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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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For me, the sound generation aspect of BIAB is a very cloudy part and each time i want to go through, very quickly i'm lost...... I know that, in BIAB forums, a lot of ink has alredy been used to deal with that subject but for me its still questionable ....
As can read here and there that BIAB (+add-ons) is reaching a sound quality which begins to be acceptable and realistic enough for live gigs.
Am i right ?
As i intend to investigate whether it is reasonable or not to go on stage with a PC equipped with all BIAB related gears, can somebody having experienced such a situation enlighten on that topic ?
More precisely, what is the best (reasonably affordable) equipment to be used for such a performance notably PC sound card and amplifier (i tried so many but i'm still unsatisfied).
Thanks
Daniel
(Britanny France)
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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My friend plays jazz and uses the Bose L1 with a sub.Very smooth consistent sound no matter were you are in the room.
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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Expert
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There are plenty of discussions in the forums about this. Here are two to get you started: 282780 281820 You question is difficult to answer as it is subjective. Any new laptop should easily be able to perform well. As far as amplification, that depends on the room. I have a Bose L1 Compact that works well for my gigs - mostly small venues
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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I doubt the Bose is a viable option in France but have not checked.
There are 2 basic ways of using Band in a Box in public performance.
The first is to use a computer running Band in a Box with line out to a mixer and both the computer sounds and the guitar sounds are mixed and go to an amplifier. You need some sort of stand for the laptop. If you are going to sing you need a mic. So you need at least a 4 channel mixer. Next you decide on a powered mixer to speakers. Do you need the speakers on poles? That depends on the size of the venue. You can have non powered speakers with a powered mixer. You can have a non-powered mixer with powered speakers.
The second type of method uses all the above without the computer. You make 'backing' tracks and use a player, like an mp3 player or similar, to make the sounds NOT the computer at the venue.
Behringer, being a maker of a lot of gear in Europe, should be available at your local places selling or renting gear. My advice would be to talk with them. Find out if you can rent gear. My first setep was a rented Fender system with 2 speakers attached to the amp that looked like a bullet. I paid per month and after 3 years owned it.
A quelle lieu exactement? Je serais a Pas de Calais et les environs le 3 ~ 6 mai.
John Conley
Musica est vita
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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Bob "Notes" Norton  Norton Music
https://www.nortonmusic.com
100% MIDI Super-Styles recorded by live, pro, studio musicians for a live groove
& Fake Disks for MIDI and/or RealTracks
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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Useful stuff, Bob -- I read the whole thing.
One question: Why not just use an MP3 player(with a backup player standing by)? (Or maybe, since this was written in 2007, you already are doing just that.)
Daisy
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Quote:
As can read here and there that BIAB (+add-ons) is reaching a sound quality which begins to be acceptable and realistic enough for live gigs.
Am i right ?
You are falling into the very old trap people who don't understand midi fall into. Biab has no sound of it's own. Think about that a minute. How can that be you ask? You play it and it sounds like crap so what do I mean by that? Biab must be connected to a synthesizer either software or hardware. If all you are using is the built in sound chip on your computer, or the free VSC DXi how good would you expect it to sound? Try hooking your PC up to the $400 Ketron sound module and then see what it sounds like. You can gig with that no problem.
This is for midi. Now for audio.
Real Tracks are a completely separate thing. Those are prerecorded audio files and they sound great but as audio you can't do an exact cover of a given song but many times people don't care because they sound so good. Biab allows you to mix some RT's with some midi tracks so if you have a good quality synth for the midi and use some RT's and maybe a Real Drum track, you can sound very good indeed.
Bob
Biab/RB latest build, Win 11 Pro, Ryzen 5 5600 G, 512 Gig SSD, 16 Gigs Ram, Steinberg UR22 MkII, Roland Sonic Cell, Kurzweil PC3, Hammond SK1, Korg PA3XPro, Garritan JABB, Hypercanvas, Sampletank 3, more.
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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It really depends on your situation. If you have chick singers that want to do "Autumn Leaves" as a Bossa in "B" (unless their voice that week needs a half step down, burn yourself some .WAV or . MP3 tracks and play them from your phone.
If you need to be a real-time Karaoke, get a Ketron.
Jan - 12 Core AMD Ryzen 9 3900X
32GB DDR4
Win 10 64-bit
Samsung m.2 SSD Boot drive,other SSD internal and USB drives.
MOTO 2
Ketron SD90
Aerophone AE-30, Yamaha WX-7
Yamaha RX-v381amp
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Right now, aside from having a couple of great amps (I have powerful Fender and Behringer "Keyboard Amps"... and a Behringer for Bass Guitar. I also use an ol' Roland GR-303 Synth Guitar/Processor, like Metheny's. I'm looking at this new synth contraption from Roland...it sounds great with all it's inate sounds... The GR-55 also features a USB song player that lets users play WAV files stored on the unit's USB flash memory, and song playback can be controlled with the onboard pedals. The GR-55 also functions as an audio/MIDI interface for computers, with a rear-panel USB 2.0 port for a quick and easy connection. Users can easily integrate with their favorite digital audio workstation software, recording GR-55 sounds as audio in the DAW and using the GR-55's super-fast pitch-to-MIDI capabilities to trigger MIDI sounds such as virtual synths and samplers with their guitar. http://www.rolandconnect.com/product.php?p=gr-55
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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I used a Bose L1 model II at a lawn party last month and got great comments from people that had heard me play before (with my yorkville pa w/sub). The sound was crisp with great sounding guitar, vocals, and amazing bass (I only use realtracks). Last week I went into Easy Music in Honolulu and plugged in my iphone with some of those tracks into the L1 compact. I was able to overdrive that fairly large store with excellent sound, so it has plenty of power. I'm thinking about getting two of them to run in stereo, as I like a stereo sound. I use a small Alan & Heath mixer with FX on the Bose.
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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Quote:
Useful stuff, Bob -- I read the whole thing.
One question: Why not just use an MP3 player(with a backup player standing by)? (Or maybe, since this was written in 2007, you already are doing just that.)
Daisy
Too many button pushes to get to the next song.
When the dance floor is full, 5 seconds between songs can be too long. By using the laptop, I can cue up the next song with two or a few keystrokes while the present song is playing. I can free my right hand for a few seconds to do this on the big keyboard. Then when the song ends, I can immediately go to the next song.
... ... ...
I read a lot of people using the Bose PA system. Word of warning, if the speakers are behind you, consider wearing ear protection if the volume exceeds 85db. Ear damage is permanent.
As far as sound quality is concerned, you need good sounds, but either a good sound module or RTs will do just fine. As long as the sound is "in the ballpark" the audience is impacted by what is being played and how it is being played much more than the tone of what is being played. It's expression more than pure sound.
Insights and incites by Notes ♫
Bob "Notes" Norton Norton Music
https://www.nortonmusic.com
100% MIDI Super-Styles recorded by live, pro, studio musicians for a live groove
& Fake Disks for MIDI and/or RealTracks
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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From an ealrier thread, here is how I do it . . .
Old IBM Thinkpad (will upgrade soon) playing BIAB "cold" right through a Yamaha 300W Pa with 12" speakers and a little Roland Cube I use for my monitor. I play my guitar through a little (but still heavy) Vox Tube Amp with a single 12" Speaker. I also use a Digitec Vocalist IV. I have everything but the speakers and guitar amp built into a rolling two tier stand that I set the laptop on. The PA speakers, stands and guitar amp fit nicely on a rolling wagon and re pretty easy to load, unload and pull. I built the PA,monitor/laptop stand my self, it too is on wheels . . . if you are interested in the setup I can send you a photo, just let me know.
PS: Add on . . . since then I have incorporated the "Fav" folder to have my sets ready and ready to go, then I simply use the Jukebox function and the play either instantly or with as many seconds you plug in between songs.
Later,
Last edited by Danny C.; 01/15/11 11:40 AM.
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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As far as sound quality is concerned, you need good sounds, but either a good sound module or RTs will do just fine. As long as the sound is "in the ballpark" the audience is impacted by what is being played and how it is being played much more than the tone of what is being played. It's expression more than pure sound.
Insights and incites by Notes ♫
Notes,
That is one hell of a point, as every performer I know is rarely 100% satisfied with their sound from time to time, especially when playing different venues, but (and it is a big but) the audience always seems "not" notice the sound imperfections concerning the performer.
Later,
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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Since we're on the topic.
Most PC soundcards on the MB are fine. They're built for DVD quality audio.
And BAIB is great live.
BAIB lets up push up and down the tempo live, and repeat chorus, etc. from midi keys.
Alas
You might want to use the same PC to play along with other VST plugins.
You may want to process both BAIB and a mic, with VST synths through some other DAW.
The problem here is that you can't mix the audio through another daw on the same system.
BAIB has no Rewire, and it doesn't work with Reaper ReaRoute.
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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I am a keyboard player and probably am the laziest user of BB. I typically will find BB style for a song and use it with only one change. I mute the bass track and play left hand bass on the keys/ I am using a Casio WK3300 for my bass keyboard and a Roland XP10 for my upper. The Casio cost less than $275 and has a terific bass tone and the best sax sound you will ever hear. The Roland is over 10 years old and is light, great sounding and has terrific strings sounds.
My laptop had been a Compaq NX9010 running XP Pro. I am in the process of setting up a Dell Inspiron 1525 with Windows 7 and BB2011. For live sound I come right out of the laptop sound jack into a Behringer Europower PMH2000 head connected to 2 - Behringer B1520 speakers. The whole PA with 2 mics cost less than $650 and has enough power for any size room or even outdoors.
I have become very adept at integrating midi files into BB in order to add guitar and other instrument parts to my songs. For example a song like Jonny B Goode would not be a good choice for a KB player unless he could have the guitar leads in the song.
I am taking delivery of a Digitech Vocalist 4 this week to add to the mix. Hopefully I can get it to work with keyboard input. BB 2011 is realy great. I had been on 2008 and I think the new features and sound are really worth the upgrade price.
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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Quote:
...I read a lot of people using the Bose PA system. Word of warning, if the speakers are behind you, consider wearing ear protection if the volume exceeds 85db. Ear damage is permanent.
...
I have never had that as a problem at all with the L-1 systems, standard or compact. These are not like the more standard PA speaker systems with treble horn and folded bass cabinet which directs the sound pressure-cooker fashion in one direction only.
I just set 'em up such that I can hear the music onstage and the direct/reflecting nature of all those smaller speakers in the tube takes care of itself along those lines.
--Mac
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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A cheap sound level meter from Radio Shack does the job just fine with any PA setup.
Set them up so they aren't too loud where you are standing.
If it's too loud, get musician's hi-fi earplugs to make up the difference.
A word to the wise.
Notes ♫
Bob "Notes" Norton Norton Music
https://www.nortonmusic.com
100% MIDI Super-Styles recorded by live, pro, studio musicians for a live groove
& Fake Disks for MIDI and/or RealTracks
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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Still related to the sound quality for BIAB live experience ......
In fact, my question can be summurized to the following : "why the sound delivered on a stage amplifier is different of the one i get directly from the speackers i have on my PC"?
Perhaps my question looks a little bit stupid but, the feeling i get from my PC at home (via my ordinary powered speakers) is very good while the one i get on a stage amplifier is very banal ... Some ideas ?
Thank you in advance for your comments,
Merci
Daniel
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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Quote:
Still related to the sound quality for BIAB live experience ......
In fact, my question can be summurized to the following : "why the sound delivered on a stage amplifier is different of the one i get directly from the speackers i have on my PC"?
Perhaps my question looks a little bit stupid but, the feeling i get from my PC at home (via my ordinary powered speakers) is very good while the one i get on a stage amplifier is very banal ... Some ideas ?
Thank you in advance for your comments,
Merci
Daniel
This is caused by different LEVELS of output.
I don't have that problem on my systems.
First thing I do is go to the Software Mixer Applet of my soundcard and turn all the Playback faders, including a Master, if there, all the way up. That will drive my Line Input of any amplification system, home or PA, with a good stout audio signal.
There may also be an issue with the Input of your PA system and its levels, as well, depending on how you are coupling the PC to the PA system.
But be advised that this is not a problem inherent to the BiaB program so much as a problem with Normalizing your systems. For example, if the Line Level signal is turned down, that alone can make the sound of everything not so full or "rich" or whatever descriptor. Drive the input hard. Get the required Volume level at the PA system's hard level controls, not in the software mixer.
--Mac
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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You also might try a USB to Audio interface. They aren't very expensive and I found that they have 3 advantages
1) Bandwidth is better than the speaker jack on most sound cards
2) No pops and crackles caused by a loose audio connection at the output jack/plug on the computer (especially when touched).
3) Line-level output
I use Edirol - bottom of the line - interfaces (no whistles and bells), and I find they work quite well.
Insights and incites by Notes ♫
Bob "Notes" Norton Norton Music
https://www.nortonmusic.com
100% MIDI Super-Styles recorded by live, pro, studio musicians for a live groove
& Fake Disks for MIDI and/or RealTracks
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Band-in-a-Box® 2025 for Mac® users: Build 904 now available!
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