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if i open up a plugin editor window and start playback, closing the editor will cause the audi to break.
It would be a good idea to make audio playback totally insulated from any GUI actions or user operations.
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It probably would be if you had a dedicated video card with all of it's own resources.
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Most users have no issue with this. May be a video issue as John mentioned.
I do not work here, but the benefits are still awesome
Make your sound your own!
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If i open sampletank, Jamstix, or any other plugin it will motorboat badly. I have heard this complaint with other programs. It was a topic for conversation at sonar a couple years back, and i have seen it else where as well. Cake did a lot to try to eliminate it, so i imagine it will get looked at here someday.
As the guys said a dedicated video card helps a lot, since the on board one has less memory to use, and pulls directly from the same resources that the audio is pulling from.
I would like to see PG spend sometime with things like this and VSTi, and ASIO issues soon.
I just expect it and never do such a thing during mix down.
HP Win 11 12 gig ram, Mac mini Sonoma with 16 gig of ram, BiaB/RB 2026, Reaper 7, Harrison Mixbus 11 , Zoom Livetrack L-8
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Do you you mean one quick break or repeated stuttering? I would expect ONE short drop because you are disturbing the CPU while it is working. A long period of stuttering if different.
I am going to keep working with ASIO drivers. The one brief time I got them to work, the mixer was immediately responsive and I liked that. With the generic drivers the mixer takes 4 beats to respond, and as rharv pointed out, it is indeed the driver doing it. The drivers I have for my M-Audio are the latest they have on their web page, so I have nowhere else to turn unless ASIO4ALL is going to work in the ling run. The time I tried them, I had no success. Errors from RB that they were not installed or configured correctly. That was weeks ago and I don't remember beyond an hour (hence the teleprompter to sing MY OWN songs...)
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Quote:
Most users have no issue with this. May be a video issue as John mentioned.
You are kidding right ?
Regarding the “quick break/stuttering” question the answer is it is definetly a kind of repeated stuttering. More than just a mere “click”.
The graphics card is internal to an iMac running under Bootcamp with Windows 7. But this ha nothing to do with video cards. As it happens theres an ATI card inside this mac, but its got nothing to do with this issue since I dont get any of these problems with Ableton or Cubase under windows 7, so its down to programming and not any card issue.
I suspect the problem has to do with the audio updating stuff being done in the main application thread that also handles the GUI. Or it may be jus to do with
issues concerinng how plugin windows are being redrawn and managed.
this may be acceptable for BIAB , but for a DAW where it is common to be modifying parameters, changing VSTI settings on the fly, etc
this is unacceptable.
And this is on top of continual issues with ASIO, false messages telling me i have the wrong MIDI driver selected etc etc.
I’ll report more on this later.
Last edited by dstenning; 08/20/11 01:51 PM.
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Quote:
if i open up a plugin editor window and start playback, closing the editor will cause the audi to break.
It would be a good idea to make audio playback totally insulated from any GUI actions or user operations.
I don't have this issue at all with the WDM drivers. I now suspect that you're using , or trying to use ,ASIO. Try upping the ASIO buffers.
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Quote:
Do you you mean one quick break or repeated stuttering? I would expect ONE short drop because you are disturbing the CPU while it is working. A long period of stuttering if different.
I am going to keep working with ASIO drivers. The one brief time I got them to work, the mixer was immediately responsive and I liked that. With the generic drivers the mixer takes 4 beats to respond, and as rharv pointed out, it is indeed the driver doing it. The drivers I have for my M-Audio are the latest they have on their web page, so I have nowhere else to turn unless ASIO4ALL is going to work in the ling run. The time I tried them, I had no success. Errors from RB that they were not installed or configured correctly. That was weeks ago and I don't remember beyond an hour (hence the teleprompter to sing MY OWN songs...)
Eddie,
If you don't need ASIO for playing a soft synth and if it's giving you issues switch back to the WDM. Then go to PREFS/AUDIO and set the playback buffers way down from the default 2000. Even with the lowly Toshiba mentioned in my sig. I can set it to 500 with no stutter and mixer moves are 99.9% real time.
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Quote:
Eddie,
If you don't need ASIO for playing a soft synth and if it's giving you issues switch back to the WDM. Then go to PREFS/AUDIO and set the playback buffers way down from the default 2000. Even with the lowly Toshiba mentioned in my sig. I can set it to 500 with no stutter and mixer moves are 99.9% real time.
I can answer that part 100%. I NEVER use soft synths anymore. I did for a while with Sonar but now that so many of you helped me learn RB I add live parts as audio tracks I play in myself on my Ensoniq synths.
I REALLY need that mixer to work without that 4 beat delay so I can fade and such. That worked with the ASIO. With the MME, the gap is killing me.
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You didn't read the whole post. Change the output buffers down to 500 or less and it will be without delay with MME/WDM. They really are WDM PG just hasn't changed the name yet.. 
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Quote:
You didn't read the whole post. Change the output buffers down to 500 or less and it will be without delay with MME/WDM. /quote]
Is THAT where the error is or is it just trying to USE those ASIO drivers?
So the buffers are the issue withe mixer and not which driver I am using. I will test that when I go up after dinner. Man if that's all it is..... And that is going to be under the "audio settings" tab on the taskbar I assume..... been in there SO many times....
TY!
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Nope Edie.In realBand go to Prefs/audio It's a setting in RB.
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Quote:
I don't have this issue at all with the WDM drivers. I now suspect that you're using , or trying to use ,ASIO. Try upping the ASIO buffers.
WDM uses far larger buffers and has greater latency than i can work with.
Im using ASIO for low latency so I can play my VSTI's without lag. Currently the buffer size is 256. Not particularly demanding really in this day and age.
I should elaborate on the "stutter" - its more like a machine gun effect.
If this was merely a question of ASIO versus WDM then i would expect this issue to be present in cubase or ableton which i can happily run on this windows machine fine at those buffer sizes with none of this stutter effect.
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Quote:
Then go to PREFS/AUDIO and set the playback buffers way down from the default 2000. Even with the lowly Toshiba mentioned in my sig. I can set it to 500 with no stutter and mixer moves are 99.9% real time.
That seems to have done it.
TY!!!! Now I have control of it again.
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Quote:
Quote:
I don't have this issue at all with the WDM drivers. I now suspect that you're using , or trying to use ,ASIO. Try upping the ASIO buffers.
WDM uses far larger buffers and has greater latency than i can work with.
Im using ASIO for low latency so I can play my VSTI's without lag. Currently the buffer size is 256. Not particularly demanding really in this day and age.
I should elaborate on the "stutter" - its more like a machine gun effect.
If this was merely a question of ASIO versus WDM then i would expect this issue to be present in cubase or ableton which i can happily run on this windows machine fine at those buffer sizes with none of this stutter effect.
If playing VSTi in real time yes you need ASIO.ASIO has always been iffy in that it works for some and not others with BIAB or RB.
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John, can you tell dstenning how you fixed your scrollbar issue? I don't remember the details. Something about which thread you were using.
It's not an unheard of problem, but its not one everyone has. So yeah, MOST users do not have this problem. I have a few machines here that do not do this. It probably is indeed something in the coding, but it only happens with some hardware setups.
*edit
dstenning, in Prefs section is a choice to use a 'descrete thread' or something similar. Try that and see if it makes a difference. Make cubase does that as a default.
Last edited by rharv; 08/21/11 09:20 AM.
I do not work here, but the benefits are still awesome
Make your sound your own!
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Quote:
dstenning, in Prefs section is a choice to use a 'descrete thread' or something similar. Try that and see if it makes a difference. Make cubase does that as a default.
I saw that option in preferences, but for some reason. It only applies to WDM , not ASIO.
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Right.
My issue, and it happens oddly enough on both of my laptops ( specs below ) is that the scroll bar will stutter, stop & jump and eventually just stop. It took me a LONG time. A week I believe to find the secret hand shake to fix this. I call replicate and fix the issue 100% of the time. I'm using WDM so the first part doesn't apply to ASIO but the second part is worth a try. The fix for me requires I do both things. If I only do one of them them problem persists. No one has ever been able to explain why this happens. here's my to things I have to do:
1. PREFS/AUDIO --- set to use a discrete thread normal priority
2. Open Task Mgr with RB open. Rt click on the RB process and set the affinity so that RB can only use one processor.
Works every time.
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I have to say, coming from a Mac environment ( and only installed windoze so i could run RB )
I find the inability of Windows 7 to provide a stable low latency audio solution surprising and disappointing
here in 2011 as we are.
Not the fault of PG music of course, but i would have thought Microsoft would have caught up with Apples CoreAudio/MIDI by now.
Clearly not.
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I run four different DAWs on my windows machine and three do not stutter when i open plug ins up or close them. This is a weakness in the RB audio engine. Sonar doesn't, Reaper Doesn't MTS doesn't.
Folks are all so quick to bash Windows. Go over to the Logic forum and read a while, you will notice that it has problems with automation, wave files, bouncing, plugins, you name it. Should we assume that all the problems are just logics, and not also Apple OS related as well?
Win 7 has shown to be a very stable capable OS for audio, and there are a lot of folks using Windows DAWs these days, even in pro studios.
On Sonar i get 4ms latency with no issues and the same is true of Reaper and MTS, RB and PTPA are right there. They do not handle my ASIO driver as well, but it is still very solid.
It is vogue to beat up Microsoft i guess, but i have several friends with Macs and they have had just as many problems as I have.
Last edited by Robh; 08/23/11 04:56 PM.
HP Win 11 12 gig ram, Mac mini Sonoma with 16 gig of ram, BiaB/RB 2026, Reaper 7, Harrison Mixbus 11 , Zoom Livetrack L-8
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