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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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Joined: Jul 2012
Posts: 28
Enthusiast
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OP
Enthusiast
Joined: Jul 2012
Posts: 28 |
Hi all,
Around mid- 2012 I posted a few questions re: BIAB and received
some great feedback. Thank you again, to all those members who
shared their knowledge and experiences with me.
(Eddie, I also once owned an ENSONIQ TS-10. Great piece of kit,
and built like a tank. But I needed more keys and a full-sized
keyboard in the end.)
I had to put my First Time purchase of BIAB on hold at that time due to medical
reasons, but I'm up and running again and ready to buy the darn thing
before December 31.
Now with Special Pricing*, the two editions I was initially interested in are:
1) *EverythingPAK = $399 (with special pricing) down from $569 ....VERY good value!
2) Audiophile Edition = $669 (NO special pricing) Why no special pricing on this one!?
A saving of $270 if I buy the EverythingPAK instead of the Audiophile Edition.
I just wanted to ask a few more questions from anyone who has either
of these two editions. From the comparison of these two editions on
the sales page, the only difference I can see is that the Audiophile
Edition comes with UN-compressed files. Most else appears to be the
same ... or am I missing something?
1) Is there any audible difference between the compressed audio files
and uncompressed files?
2) Is it easier to work with the uncompressed files?
I read one post a while back on this forum where one member said
he'd bought either the EverythingPACK or UltraPlusPack and he'd run into difficulty using the
audio files (for some reason), and commented how he wished he'd bought
the Audiophile Edition instead (because the uncompressed files were
apparently easier to work with.)??????
Basically, except for the difference in the price, what are the pros
and cons of the EverythingPAK and the Audiophile Edition?
Compressed audio files versus UN-compressed audio files ... difference?
What is the benefit of buying the Audiophile Edition over the EverythingPAK?
Also,is the $25 bonus 8 tracks disc worth buying?
I just want to be able to make an informed decision between the two editions
before the end of the year.
Many thanks in advance for helping enlighten me : )
Peace and Happiness,
Dome
BIAB Audiophile, Reaper, Kontakt Full Edition, Roland A90-EX Master Controller MIDI keyboard, Windows 7 x64
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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Joined: Jul 2012
Posts: 103
Apprentice
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Apprentice
Joined: Jul 2012
Posts: 103 |
As PG uses the terms,
I believe that "compressed" refers to data reduction (for example, mp3).
"Uncompressed" is in the form of the original recording (like a CD).
If it were just a matter of compression, the files could then simply be
uncompressed, like a zip file. And then there would be no difference.
File compression, as I usually see the term used, preserves everything.
The original file can be reconstructed right down to the last bit.
I don't think PG uses the term this way, but instead means data reduction,
so there would be some loss of quality.
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 27,506
Veteran
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Veteran
Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 27,506 |
Megafiddle has the right idea. When PG Music makes the recordings that will become RealTracks, they record them as .WAV files, CD quality. These are the files you get with the audiophile edition.
To make the 'regular' edition, they compress these files to .WMA format, to about one-tenth the file size. With over 1000 RealTracks, this difference in size on the hard drive is considerable. Doing so means there is a loss of some audio quality. It isn't a great difference. If you want to have more discussion on that, we can talk more about it. Bottom line, if you intend to make commercial use of your backing tracks, then you would want the audiophile edition.
Then, probably more detail than you need to know at this point, but Megafiddle mentioned the concept, it is possible to uncompress the .WMA files. Although this is done automatically when you use the program, it does not change the quality. If you choose to batch uncompress the files (an option), it makes them much larger (back to the original size the .WAV files would have been) but it saves a tiny bit of time running each song since the program does not need to uncompress on the fly, so to speak.
But I'm guessing you are most interested in the second paragraph.
BIAB 2025 Win Audiophile. Software: Studio One 7 Pro, Swam horns, Acoustica-7, Notion 6, Song Master Pro, Win 11 Home. Hardware: Intel i9, 32 Gb; Presonus 192 & Faderport 8, Royer 121, Slate VSX, Adam Sub8 & Neumann 120 monitors.
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 392
Journeyman
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Journeyman
Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 392 |
"lossy compression" used to reduce the file size is...I am fairly sure what PG uses. MANY pros will suggest that depending on the "bit rate" some compressed files sound exactly as good as the source uncompressed files.
At 320 kbps the majority of experts I've talked to say they can't tell the differnce vs. masters played over pro studio gear.
At 192 kbps they say you have to have HIGHLY critical hearing to tell the difference.
At the lower bit rates...160 and 128, do NOT bet a sound engineer that he can't tell the difference unless you really LIKE to lose. (-:
OF COURSE, what counts is individuals using their ears to hear and waveforms on a video screen don't prove anything.
I would GUESS that maybe 20% of the BIAB users could tell the difference between "regular" BIAB...the Audiophile version.
BUT....and this is KEY....what you hear depends on the AMPLIFIER and SPEAKERS (headphones) in use which makes it a truly..."quality in...garbage out" possibility.
Conversely, a GREAT audio set up won't help poor recording quality because if the data ain't there, it ain't there.
Personally, if I didn't have KNOWN highly critical hearing over most of the frequency spectrum AND A VERY HIGH QUALITY amplifier/speaker combo, the regular version should be JUST FINE.
Best,
Jim
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 27,506
Veteran
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Veteran
Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 27,506 |
I concur with some of what Jim wrote.
Yes, the .WMA format PG Music uses is a 'lossy' compression.
Yes, you need a very good listening environment, including monitors, to hear much of a difference. And your high-frequency hearing should be better than someone my age normally has (and there are a lot of us here over 60, but for some reason, one of my ears still hears this stuff).
It isn't just the compression rate; that matters a lot, but different instruments show compression effects differently. I listen to solo piano, solo acoustic guitar, and cymbals, because I can hear compression more on those instruments. Chances are, to win the bet, the good sound engineer will listen to those, too.
We have had MANY discussions about the quality difference over the years since the audiophile version became available, but none in awhile and that means you can't search for them in this forum that far back. I can tell you that, once PG Music went to the Elastique algorithm a few years ago, the difference between 'regular' and audiophile editions became less.
Noise in a mix of multiple tracks adds up. Again, the audiophile version is the one to use in a commercial setting, where this becomes more important. But Jim is correct, the 'regular' version is nevertheless quite fine.
You can always start with the regular edition, and upgrade later. It was years ago, but I did that, and PG Music Sales worked with me very fairly.
BIAB 2025 Win Audiophile. Software: Studio One 7 Pro, Swam horns, Acoustica-7, Notion 6, Song Master Pro, Win 11 Home. Hardware: Intel i9, 32 Gb; Presonus 192 & Faderport 8, Royer 121, Slate VSX, Adam Sub8 & Neumann 120 monitors.
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 904
Expert
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Expert
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 904 |
If you`re not working on a pro studio CD, you should go with the "normal" SuperPAK or, if you need some piano or guitar lessons, with the EverythingPAK.
Bear in mind, that, if you take the audiophile edition you`ll always have to take the Audiophile editions for future updates as well. This can become very expensive. If I remember correctly, the minimum upgrade from a x.5 version to the recent version 199$. While with the normal SuperPAK (has all Realtracks, Styles etc. except Lessons), you can upgrade for less money!
Sandra
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 27,506
Veteran
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Veteran
Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 27,506 |
Very good point from Sandra. The audiophile updates are more expensive.
Technically, you don't HAVE to update from audiophile to audiophile, though. In any version of BIAB, if there is a .WAV file in the folder for the RealTrack selected, BIAB uses it. That .WAV file could be an audiophile version, or an uncompressed .WMA file from the regular version. If no .WAV file is present, BIAB loads, uncompresses and uses the .WMA file. You can have a mix. But I agree, you would normally want to update the audiophile version with more audiophile updates.
BIAB 2025 Win Audiophile. Software: Studio One 7 Pro, Swam horns, Acoustica-7, Notion 6, Song Master Pro, Win 11 Home. Hardware: Intel i9, 32 Gb; Presonus 192 & Faderport 8, Royer 121, Slate VSX, Adam Sub8 & Neumann 120 monitors.
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 59
Enthusiast
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Enthusiast
Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 59 |
Thanks guys for explaining this all so nicely.
Can I just confirm one thing then: If I have the Audiophile version I do not have to do anything. BIAB will automatically use the best quality files around. There is no button that needs clicking to switch from compressed format to CD quality?
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 27,506
Veteran
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Veteran
Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 27,506 |
Correct! Just use it and enjoy.
BIAB 2025 Win Audiophile. Software: Studio One 7 Pro, Swam horns, Acoustica-7, Notion 6, Song Master Pro, Win 11 Home. Hardware: Intel i9, 32 Gb; Presonus 192 & Faderport 8, Royer 121, Slate VSX, Adam Sub8 & Neumann 120 monitors.
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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Joined: May 2000
Posts: 38,502
Veteran
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Veteran
Joined: May 2000
Posts: 38,502 |
Quite a few CDs and Commercial Music endeavors have been made using the standard BiaB cmpressed realtracks files.
My recommendation would be to start with the less expensive standard version, use it, and then if you think you could benefit from the audiophile version, consider taking that plunge later.
--Mac
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 59
Enthusiast
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Enthusiast
Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 59 |
True what Mac says, but I've been paying vocalists over $5,000 to record an album. Paying the $500 extra to get pristeen guitars is relatively a bargain. That is about the equevalent of less than 4 studio sessions for guitarist.
It would have been even more perfect if the drums could have been split out by the stems (i.e. kick, snare, hats, cymbals, etc on seperate tracks).
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Ask sales and support questions about Band-in-a-Box using natural language.
ChatPG's knowledge base includes the full Band-in-a-Box User Manual and sales information from the website.
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Band-in-a-Box® 2025 for Mac® users: Build 904 now available!
If you're already using Band-in-a-Box® 2025 for Mac®, make sure to grab the latest update! Build 904 is now available for download and includes the newest additions and enhancements from our team.
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Tablature now includes a “Save bends when saving XML” option for improved compatibility with PG Music tools. Plus, you can instantly match all track heights with a simple Ctrl-release after resizing, and Add2 chords from MGU/SGU files are now fully supported... and more!
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There's an amazing collection of new content too, including 202 RealTracks, new RealStyles, MIDI SuperTracks, Instrumental Studies, “Songs with Vocals” Artist Performance Sets, Playable RealTracks Set 5, two RealDrums Stems sets, XPro Styles PAK 10, Xtra Styles PAK 21, and much more!
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Happy New Year!
Thank you for being part of the Band-in-a-Box® community.
Wishing you and yours a very happy 2026—Happy New Year from all of us at PG Music!
Season's Greetings!
Wishing everyone a happy, healthy holiday season—thanks for being part of our community!
The office will be closed for Christmas Day, but we will be back on Boxing Day (Dec 26th) at 6:00am PST.
Team PG
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