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Hi all, This is pretty close to done but I'd still welcome any constructive comments about how the mix / arrangement might be improved. (BIAB was not used). https://soundcloud.com/st-josephs-social-club/hello-in-there-john-prine-cover-draft-13-sept-2016If you comment, please mention what you listened to it on (e.g. cans, monitors, phone speaker etc) Also note that the underlying WAV file, which is closest to what I'd intended, is downloadable from Soundcloud. (Finally, sorry, but the totally random track which SoundCloud plays after this has nothing to do with me. Anyone know how to prevent this?)
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Man, John Prine is such a good writer. I used to play live and had a few JP songs in my song list. They always played well with the audience.
I'm listening on speakers.
The vox are boxy and dry. Nicely done but also could use some pitch correction in a few places. It sounds like you are a bit too close to the mic. No breathing room.
Guitar and instruments sound good. That steel is really sweet, as is the guitar.
For such a song, the bare bones approach you took works well. I like the pause at 1:53. Nice. The second time... not so much. Do it once for effect.
Are you aware that to post a cover tune here, you need to have licensed the rights and post the license number in your OP. Not my rules, but the rules of PG.
So good that I listened twice.... love the bare bones aspect. Fix the vocals and you got a good tune.
You can find my music at: www.herbhartley.comAdd nothing that adds nothing to the music. You can make excuses or you can make progress but not both. The magic you are looking for is in the work you are avoiding.
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Thanks for the listening, and for the feedback.
May I ask,
-- which words did you hear which have pitch problems?
-- I'm not sure I understand the protocol here -- there is also a post here with a (very nice) cover of 500 Miles, which no one cited for any breach ... in fact you chimed in with some praise, but no censure... What's the deal?
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Yes, there was another user who posted a link to a Facebook posting of a totally different user. The posting party should have known better. The singer had little control over someone else linking to her cover posted on line. PG staff should have addressed that post for it's obvious copyright violation. Again, it's their rules, not mine. I do tend to point out cover/copyright to folks who are new or rarely come in here just so they are aware of the rules for future reference.
We do have at least one user here who records covers and does do it the correct way, getting the license and posting that information in his posts.
I commented on that cover post but my comments were sidebar at best and nothing related to the performance.
Perhaps now that PG staff are visiting the forums they can enforce the rules they made.
Anyway, I didn't intend to come off sounding like a forum cop.... it was intended to be a friendly FYI.
On to other things now.....
Pitch issues: Start at 1:24 thru 1:36 and again at 3:20 when this same part repeats. These pitch issues are not huge.... but subtle and there's also an "unsure quaver" in the held notes. Different from a natural vibrato. With Melodyne it's a quick, transparent fix for both issues. I mentioned the pitch issues only because this song is an otherwise flawless performance once you get the EQ and reverb issues on the vox resolved.
Even though it's a cover, I'd love to hear this with the vox track fixed.
You can find my music at: www.herbhartley.comAdd nothing that adds nothing to the music. You can make excuses or you can make progress but not both. The magic you are looking for is in the work you are avoiding.
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“I'm not sure I understand the protocol here....” The protocol here is the same as everywhere else in the civilized world. You cannot record/perform/publish copyrighted material without a license to do so. PG's forum rule is superfluous. Prine is with BMI, by the way, in case you'd like to pay him.  Regards, Bob
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Hi, 90 db,
Sir, there's no need to be nasty after the question has already been answered, with respect it adds nothing.
I think I made it quite clear I was only asking why a link to a cover version on social media of 500 miles seemed ok here, while a link to a cover on social media of Hello In There didn't. Fair question in all, which Guitarhacker was kind enough to explain.
Seeing covers all over the internet, and 500 Miles here, made me think it was ok to post a cover here. Fair enough, live and learn.
Perhaps for consistency's sake you might want to post your views on the subject on other threads here featuring covers.
Last edited by lingyai; 09/16/16 07:12 AM.
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Hi, 90 db,
Sir, there's no need to be nasty after the question has already been answered, with respect it adds nothing.
I think I made it quite clear I was only asking why a link to a cover version on social media of 500 miles seemed ok here, while a link to a cover on social media of Hello In There didn't. Fair question in all, which Guitarhacker was kind enough to explain.
Seeing covers all over the internet, and 500 Miles here, made me think it was ok to post a cover here. Fair enough, live and learn.
Perhaps for consistency's sake you might want to post your views on the subject on other threads here featuring covers.
My comments weren't meant to be nasty. Sorry if they came off that way. I can be rather direct.  If you recall, I actually helped you cover another song on this thread: http://www.pgmusic.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Main=52259&Number=362425#Post362425 As Herb said, that other song should not have been posted either without compensating Hedy West, the composer. “Perhaps for consistency's sake you might want to post your views on the subject on other threads here featuring covers.” Now, that sounds a bit nasty. Regards, Bob
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Am I right in thinking that Youtube has a way around any songs cover violation by having an ad at start of song, and then usually don't take the cover down.....or is this a total figment of my imagination?
Maybe the way to go, as the fella says if no money involved, highly unlikely anyone is going to sue you.
Musiclover
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YouTube has several options. They think what they are doing is in compliance with copyright.
BIAB 2025 Win Audiophile. Software: Studio One 7 Pro, Swam horns, Acoustica-7, Notion 6, Song Master Pro, Win 11 Home. Hardware: Intel i9, 32 Gb; Roland Integra-7, Presonus 192 & Faderport 8, Royer 121, Adam Sub8 & Neumann 120 monitors.
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YouTube has several options. They think what they are doing is in compliance with copyright. Not sure what they think!  But they realized that monetizing content rather than removing it is usually preferred by all parties involved!
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Am I right in thinking that Youtube has a way around any songs cover violation by having an ad at start of song, and then usually don't take the cover down.....or is this a total figment of my imagination?
Maybe the way to go, as the fella says if no money involved, highly unlikely anyone is going to sue you.
Musiclover they allow folks to post. if a take-down request comes in they will honor it. they also use automated systems that "watch" every video and tag it if it is suspect. and they then monetize the video with ads and share the revenue with the owner. they used to be very aggressive with folks who posted copyrighted content; you would get something like three complaints and they would disable your channel and delete all your videos. I think these days they either monetize or block without disabling your account. it is all about the money (always has been!)
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“Perhaps for consistency's sake you might want to post your views on the subject on other threads here featuring covers.” Now, that sounds a bit nasty. Sir, I posted here to hear views on a mix of a cover, and have in the process learned that is against the rules, which I will abide by. I did not wish for a discussion about anything else. But there is nothing nasty about saying that rules should be the same for everyone; and by "rules" I include their "enforcement" via posts, like Guitarhacker's friendly nudge, as well as your your post (I reckon there are different flavours of directness). I just wonder, if you feel so strongly about this issue to post as you did here, why not also in the 500 Miles thread? That thread was, to me, a green light to post mine. Only now I'm scatching my head as to why only I get the traffic ticket. I'd just as soon have this thread continue like that one, that is, with comments on the song. Or at least to not go further off topic.
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"Sir, I posted here to hear views on a mix of a cover, and have in the process learned that is against the rules, which I will abide by." And yet, your cover of a copyrighted song still appears in this thread, contrary to the rules. Priceless.
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Guys, give it a rest ok?
Herb just started a thread complimenting PG on how active the staff has become on the forums lately and we all chimed in agreeing how cool it is and how great a company PG is for doing that.
I can't keep up with copyright stuff any more, How YT does it, how Soundcloud does it, all of it. I just don't give a damn. I used to but not now. Whatever the so called rules are they seem to be very arbitrary to me. Soundcloud itself is supposed to have very sophisticated 'bots that can detect verboten material just from analyzing the audio file. If they do I've seen zero evidence of it. I have copywritten stuff up there and it's been up for years now. I've tried to be cute and not put the correct song title up, just things like Wavetest 1 and stuff like that but I don't think even that matters.
About the only thing I understand about YT for example is if the rights owner complains they will remove it, otherwise they stay up. Out of my very extensive YT bookmarks a very small number have been removed at the request of the owner. It seems like the vast majority of artists don't seem to mind and I mean legendary names too.
If there's a problem let the forum mods handle it I see NO NEED for any of us to keep bringing it up. Just post whatever you want and see what happens. If they take it down, then they take it down.
To the OP, I like your version of this. Sure the vocals are not perfect but what folk songs are? Uhhh, none of them? Anybody really think Dylan is some great singer? Folk singers don't try to be Striesand or Sinatra. It's never been their thing to be great vocalists. Folk is all about the feeling and the words. Personally I think this is a pretty good first draft so Lingyai keep it up.
Bob
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Hi lingyai. I think your interpretation of this song is just lovely. Your treatment of it is so gentle. I don't hear any problems with the vocal.
I love this John Prine song and also perform it live quite a bit. (I have a biab backing track. Pm me if you would like me to send it to you. It is a little more up tempo than your version).
I think on the whole "cover" thing, the "safest" place to upload covers online is YouTube because of the content id system they have. The copyright owners can elect to have the content taken down or they can elect to monetize it. Most of the copyright owners elect to monetize. But still, the worst that can happen is you can get an email asking you to remove the video. To post the song on YouTube you don't need to make a video, you can just use a still picture or graphic.
So my view is, go for it, there really is not much to loose and many many careers have been launched by posting cover tunes on YouTube.
Last edited by JoanneCooper; 09/17/16 07:30 PM.
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Does that mean the forum rules are now officially "Out the Window" and all that mumbo-jumbo about copyright no longer applies to anything?
Last edited by Guitarhacker; 09/18/16 03:38 AM.
You can find my music at: www.herbhartley.comAdd nothing that adds nothing to the music. You can make excuses or you can make progress but not both. The magic you are looking for is in the work you are avoiding.
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Does that mean the forum rules are now officially "Out the Window" and all that mumbo-jumbo about copyright no longer applies to anything? not saying that at all. Just trying to say that posting on Youtube is probably the "best" (only?) place to post covers. You will notice I did not say anything about posting to this forum.
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Well if YouTube has monetized the music.... and the artist is satisfied with that and is apparently being compensated financially......
What's the problem with posting covers that are posted on YouTube? It would appear to be "just as good" as having the license and posting the song on some other server site. No?
You can find my music at: www.herbhartley.comAdd nothing that adds nothing to the music. You can make excuses or you can make progress but not both. The magic you are looking for is in the work you are avoiding.
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Xtra Styles PAK 20 for Windows & Mac Band-in-a-Box version 2025 (and higher) is here with 200 brand new RealStyles!
We're excited to bring you our latest and greatest in the all new Xtra Styles PAK 20 for Band-in-a-Box! This fresh installment is packed with 200 all-new styles spanning the rock & pop, jazz, and country genres you've come to expect, as well as the exciting inclusion of electronic styles!
In this PAK you’ll discover: Minimalist Modern Funk, New Wave Synth Pop, Hard Bop Latin Groove, Gospel Country Shuffle, Cinematic Synthwave, '60s Motown, Funky Lo-Fi Bossa, Heavy 1980s Metal, Soft Muted 12-8 Folk, J-Pop Jazz Fusion, and many more!
All the Xtra Styles PAKs 1 - 20 are on special for only $29 each (reg $49), or get all 209 PAKs for $199 (reg $399)! Order now!
Learn more and listen to demos of the Xtra Styles PAK 20.
Video: Xtra Styles PAK 20 Overview & Styles Demos: Watch now!
Note: The Xtra Styles require the UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, or Audiophile Edition of Band-in-a-Box®. (Xtra Styles PAK 20 requires the 2025 or higher UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, or Audiophile Edition. They will not work with the Pro or MegaPAK version because they need the RealTracks from the UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, or Audiophile Edition.
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