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I don't know if the information is somewhere that can be accessed on my computer, or if it was ever posted here, but after finding out about Neil Swainman the other day, I'd like to know who the other musicians are who have made the Real Drums and Real Tracks.
Gary
I'm blessed watching God do what He does best. I've had a few rough years, and I'm still not back to where I want to be, but I'm on the way and things are looking far better now than what they were!
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When you pull up the list of your available Real Tracks, look at the far right. The last column is headed "artist". That column is not there for the drums though. The only drummer's name I've seen is Terry Clarke because that's the name on that particular RD set. I had never heard of him but I mentioned him to a couple of drummer friends and they told me he's a big name player. I have no idea who did the other drum tracks.
Bob
Biab/RB latest build, Win 11 Pro, Ryzen 5 5600 G, 512 Gig SSD, 16 Gigs Ram, Steinberg UR22 MkII, Roland Sonic Cell, Kurzweil PC3, Hammond SK1, Korg PA3XPro, Garritan JABB, Hypercanvas, Sampletank 3, more.
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Hi Gary. I recall that, to see this new info, you need one of the more recent patches. But of course, you have that... this is just for others.
BIAB 2025 Win Audiophile. Software: Studio One 7 Pro, Swam horns, Acoustica-7, Notion 6, Song Master Pro, Win 11 Home. Hardware: Intel i9, 32 Gb; Presonus 192 & Faderport 8, Royer 121, Slate VSX, Adam Sub8 & Neumann 120 monitors.
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Are you referring to the artist known as 'PG musician'? I would like to know who that is too. Maybe there are legal reasons why this artist is anonymous
Follow That Dream Sam Karaoke King -------------------- Turning that corner again - I have to keep following that dream, no matter what
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Might be a silly question but could a guy give the RT musicians credit on the album notes? Just askin'.
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Quote:
Might be a silly question but could a guy give the RT musicians credit on the album notes? Just askin'.
I don't think it is fair to the artists to do that.
For one thing, a RealTrack performance is not necessarily representative of the artist's work.
For another, this would certainly fall under the domain of the Studio Session Player era of recordings, in which the session players had already been compensated and thus no royalties were due them. In 1976 all that was famously changed and that is why session players names started appearing on albums. It is also why the famous studio session bands disappeared.
I think it is alright to credit PGMusic on your work, we can even download little BIAB icons for placement on album liners, that would be appropriate.
--Mac
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Peter Gannon answered this question a few years ago when Real Tracks first became available and the artists were identified. His answer was similar to Mac's last sentence. If I recall correctly, he said you did not have to put their names on your CD, but you could give a credit to PG Music if you wished.
[This is another example of great info that is lost on this forum when you cannot search back that far.]
BIAB 2025 Win Audiophile. Software: Studio One 7 Pro, Swam horns, Acoustica-7, Notion 6, Song Master Pro, Win 11 Home. Hardware: Intel i9, 32 Gb; Presonus 192 & Faderport 8, Royer 121, Slate VSX, Adam Sub8 & Neumann 120 monitors.
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Quote:
Might be a silly question but could a guy give the RT musicians credit on the album notes? Just askin'.
You ask 'could' not 'should'. Why would you want to, unless you are trying to boost your own product placement?
The real artist here is YOU. The PG software is just a tool at the end of the day that has helped you to create your masterpiece
Follow That Dream Sam Karaoke King -------------------- Turning that corner again - I have to keep following that dream, no matter what
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That's a good point, Sam. But if an artist is not trying to boost his/her product placement, it is not a serious effort. I play just a few concerts a year now, but all the people I hire are full-time top professionals, and I shamelessly use their names to gain a wider audience and more CD sales. Unfortunately, success in the music business is often more about the business than the music.
That does not extend to this case, however. I liked Mac's point that the playing generated by the computer may not be fully reflective of what those artists would choose to sound like in person, or even on a recording. If I released a CD with Real Tracks backing (and I've given it some thought; Gary keeps asking me to do it), I would credit something like "Additional instrumental parts by PG Music".
BIAB 2025 Win Audiophile. Software: Studio One 7 Pro, Swam horns, Acoustica-7, Notion 6, Song Master Pro, Win 11 Home. Hardware: Intel i9, 32 Gb; Presonus 192 & Faderport 8, Royer 121, Slate VSX, Adam Sub8 & Neumann 120 monitors.
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A very good point, Matt, and well made. Having studied music business management back in the '80s, I couldn't agree with you more. However, I would take the high road or the low road and not the road in between. As to which I will take when I get there, I don't know. Perhaps something along the lines of putting an asterisk next to each artist name for the 'PG session musicians' who are on that track and listing them.
Then adding a proviso at the bottom of the playlist to the effect that: 'performances courtesy of PG Music'?
Nothing illegal or dishonest in that, eh?
Follow That Dream Sam Karaoke King -------------------- Turning that corner again - I have to keep following that dream, no matter what
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Good suggestions, Sam.
I wonder if anyone has done something like this yet with a CD they released?
BIAB 2025 Win Audiophile. Software: Studio One 7 Pro, Swam horns, Acoustica-7, Notion 6, Song Master Pro, Win 11 Home. Hardware: Intel i9, 32 Gb; Presonus 192 & Faderport 8, Royer 121, Slate VSX, Adam Sub8 & Neumann 120 monitors.
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I would not want to put anything in print that would mislead people into thinking that the musicians listed might have been present at the session where I made the recording.
Therefore I would not list their names.
But I *would* mention Band in a Box if I wanted folks to know more.
--Mac
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Quote:
Perhaps something along the lines of putting an asterisk next to each artist name for the 'PG session musicians' who are on that track and listing them.
I have to disagree here, Sam. The PG players are not "session musicians" in the normal definition of the term. They were not hired by you to play on your specific songs. They played very generic parts that were designed to be usable in a wide variety of situations that has nothing to do with your production. I most definitely would not want to be credited for that because as Mac said I had no input at all in your production. I wouldn't want to muddy up the waters and have people saying "is that the best he could come up with??"
These RT's and RD's are great tools but they can't follow an arrangement to the level of a commercial production except for certain restrictive things like a background guitar or a lick here and there unless you're only talking about really simple stuff like strumming guitar folk songs. Anything more complex like the Eagles, Queen, Garth Brooks, Tower of Power etc are not going to be done at that level using Real Tracks. Great for demo work though.
Bob
Biab/RB latest build, Win 11 Pro, Ryzen 5 5600 G, 512 Gig SSD, 16 Gigs Ram, Steinberg UR22 MkII, Roland Sonic Cell, Kurzweil PC3, Hammond SK1, Korg PA3XPro, Garritan JABB, Hypercanvas, Sampletank 3, more.
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I was thinking of crediting stuff on my work, but I didn't think it felt right to credit the musicians. However, I did want to know who they were, just as a matter of finding out more about them.
But, I may put something like 'Backing Tracks Provided by Real Tracks!'
I'm not sure yet.
Gary
I'm blessed watching God do what He does best. I've had a few rough years, and I'm still not back to where I want to be, but I'm on the way and things are looking far better now than what they were!
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That would work, Gary. Perhaps you could use the name "PG Music" in there somewhere, so people could easily follow up and find out more.
BIAB 2025 Win Audiophile. Software: Studio One 7 Pro, Swam horns, Acoustica-7, Notion 6, Song Master Pro, Win 11 Home. Hardware: Intel i9, 32 Gb; Presonus 192 & Faderport 8, Royer 121, Slate VSX, Adam Sub8 & Neumann 120 monitors.
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Jazzmammal gets right to the heart of it.
I agree with that assessment.
--Mac
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I really want to credit the actual musicians, but I also understand the arguments against it.
Maybe something like "Instrument work made possible by PG Music. Samples provided by PlayerX, PlayerZ, etc" ?
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Wow, lots of comments!
Very good points made. Thinking it over, I think I would maybe give credit to PG Music but not to the specific musicians. I don't want to give the false impression that they were personally at the sessions. I think these sounds are very good, for demos and maybe beyond, (If you have a REALLY good song).
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But-- doesn't my approach make clear who did what and how?
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Quote:
But-- doesn't my approach make clear who did what and how?
There aren't that many people out in the real world who understand what it is that Band in a Box does or can do.
I find that out every time I take Band in a Box out on a live performance gig, even after explaining it to people, they go away thinking that I'm playing along with a mere recording.
Trying to explain that on album credits would only very likely further muddy the waters, so to speak.
But you should do what you think is the thing to do, of course.
--Mac
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