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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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Joined: Nov 2008
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Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 69 |
Sorry... and it's not even my thread. As a songwriter I just feel bad about not finding a way, even indirectly, at pointing people toward the useful resources. I don't mean just stopping at mentioning PGMusic... I was hoping for feedback on some of my suggestions.
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 235
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Apprentice
Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 235 |
Quote:
I get the feeling many dismiss my sentiments out of hand without really considering them, but oh well. It's the internet.
I apologize if my remarks upset you. I was/am coming from the position of what a professional musician should do if they're using BIAB for demo submissions or singer/songwriter demos. If you're selling yourself as a songwriter to publishers, or making a vocal demo to submit to a label, you don't want anything to get in the way of your message. Telling a publisher or label "how you did it" or crediting the live musicians means nothing to them. It detracts, and that was my only point.
I understood your sentiments and considered them carefully before I made any response. I'm only pointing out that from a professional point of view, it isn't done, nor is it a good idea. If you only do this stuff for fun, then I agree with you; spread the word. I'm sure I've helped BIAB sell a lot of copies of this wonderful program. Hell, I even worked the BIAB booth at their first NAMM show so that Peter could take a break.
Yeah, it's the Internet, but I spent a lot of money on phone calls to Peter in Canada in the early days, and he considered me a Beta tester back then, so I'm not exactly new to BIAB, Peter Gannon, or the music industry in general.
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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For which, Harvey, we are all of us extremely grateful. Thank you By all reckonings, your professional experience in the music business has been more than invaluable as input into the programme and your presence on the forum is much appreciated. You may not post as often as Mac, or some others, but what you do post when you post is very sound advice (no pun intended  ). Quite frankly, I find it amazing to think where PG software has reached - this ain't loops, this is REAL! So a very big 'Thank You' to Peter too. I don't know where I would be without it. On an aside, I was out with a friend last night who is a singer-songwriter with his own 3 piece band (him on rhythm guitar and vocals, along with an accordionist and a bass player) and he STILL doesn't understand what the PG software can do - he still insists it is merely 'computer generated'. Well, once I have a few new tracks up and running he may well change his mind. To him, a computer is still merely a fancy typewriter - and he's only 53...
Follow That Dream Sam Karaoke King -------------------- Turning that corner again - I have to keep following that dream, no matter what
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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Joined: May 2005
Posts: 1,992
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WienSam
re your friend of 53.
ive come across that a zillion times mate.
and tons worse.
i dont know why software generates massive emotions in some people.
On a well known music software net forum recently where
i tried to open peoples eyes to the possibilities of the new biab/realband
combo i was attacked left and right by obviously people useing other
software that dont have biab/rb capabilities.
some people commented silly stuff like they would sooner use manuscript paper.
others accused me of working for pg. totally silly comments.
(harvey knows the site well.)
finally the mods locked the thread i suspect because of preassure from
people useing other solutions.
i still havent heard back from the mods why they closed the thread.
whats silly bout the whole thing is ive been saveing up for the
biab/rb combo due to medical issues in my family. i'm just a ptraks user.
i think some people view the software as some sort of threat,
cos it certainly is a breakthru imho.
but some people just dont get it and have in built biases relating
to auto generation. c'est la vie..lol.
retired puter engr....powertracks on amd......NICE !
"what is the black art of audio engineering ?"
my silly songs...motagator.com/bmanning
see my tips in the tips section.
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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Joined: Aug 2009
Posts: 21
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I decided to give myself credit for being smart enough to find this software and learn how to use it. So I will definitely list my name on the album credits.  Now to actually create something and quit with the blah, blah, blah.
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 7,693
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Manning, you're experience is probably due to what I mentioned last week. When you're on other forums, you're up against the real heavyweight in the music business and that's rap, hip hop and techno. People who are into that stuff are basically on a different planet than any of us here. I'm not questioning the legitimacy of those styles because there is talent there but it's so foreign to us that it's a case of everybody on both sides simply talking past each other. It's exactly the same as our parents coming out of the big band era going into rock and roll. Remember all the acrimony? After winning WWII, it was they who were the "masters of the universe" and their music was "it", no questions. And deservedly so when you think about it. It was 30 years before my mother who was a competition swing dancer in the 40's and 50's finally said the Beatles wrote some good stuff. PG did release some urban Real Tracks and styles but I've never used them and I don't believe I've seen a single comment about them here.
Bob
Biab/RB latest build, Win 11 Pro, Ryzen 5 5600 G, 512 Gig SSD, 16 Gigs Ram, Steinberg UR22 MkII, Roland Sonic Cell, Kurzweil PC3, Hammond SK1, Korg PA3XPro, Garritan JABB, Hypercanvas, Sampletank 3, more.
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I don't think it is a generation thing. My 'son' (actually a friend of mine who is only 17 and I am about to turn 50 - never having married or had any kids, I look on him as the son I never had) has absolutely no interest whatsoever in techno, house or hip-hop. He plays e-bass and loves the music of 'our generation'. Only this afternoon he was listening to the Rolling Stones and loves Heavy Metal (AC/DC in particular). He personally cannot see any musicality in the modern 'disco' club music... I gave him a very quick demo of BIAB by creating in less than 3 minutes a whole new song in a Heavy Metal style and he was very impressed and over the moon! He is also in a band of teenagers who are into Heavy Metal, so he is not the only one Furthermore, his musical interests include: Jimi Hendrix, The Rolling Stones, Johnny Cash, Elvis Presley, The Rat Pack, The Animals and more. You should see the wide assortment of tracks on his iPod player. Last time we went out to sing together in a karaoke club, he was singing something by Willy Nelson... Mind you, he can't sing to save his life!
Follow That Dream Sam Karaoke King -------------------- Turning that corner again - I have to keep following that dream, no matter what
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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Posts: 10,193
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OP
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Quote:
 Bad singers are a real turn off - sometimes you want to curl up in embarrassment at their hideous out-of-tune performances (that they don't realise are so dreadful they need the shepherd's crook to pull them off stage). I find it all the time, particularly at karaoke gigs
Which is why the dogs in the neighborhood and I have an agreement....I don't sing, they don't leave 'presents' around my car.
Gary
I'm blessed watching God do what He does best. I've had a few rough years, and I'm still not back to where I want to be, but I'm on the way and things are looking far better now than what they were!
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Sam, I think part of the 'computer generated' music is quite often centered around the usually poor sounds of a GM sound set. So, you could have the most perfect song, and listen to it with a GM sound set, and it'll still sound 'computer generated.' The one person that really can provide some awesome GM tracks, in my opinion, is Gary Wachtel of GaryW0001@aol.com fame. His ability to turn charts into performances shows the inherent capability of the GM sound set. However, I would LOVE to hear some of his music programmed for the higher banks of a SD2. Without Real Tracks, I still think that your friend may have second thoughts over 'computer generated.' Get people away from poor samples and poorly written midi files (of which I am guilty of) and they will have a better impression of what 'computer music' can be. Gary
I'm blessed watching God do what He does best. I've had a few rough years, and I'm still not back to where I want to be, but I'm on the way and things are looking far better now than what they were!
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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Joined: Jul 2000
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manning1, that's a good story about your experience on another forum.
I was reading one of those other 'major software' forums and responded to a question, "What do you use for drums?'. Of course, there were pages and pages about drum software, and more than a few responses of 'hire a real drummer', but I was the only one to mention PG Music's Real Drums. I was completely serious, but my comment was met with the typical silence. At least I wasn't run out of town like you were, but having them ignore good info because of preconceived notions is not much better.
Hang in there and keep educating.
BIAB 2025 Win Audiophile. Software: Studio One 7 Pro, Swam horns, Acoustica-7, Notion 6, Song Master Pro, Win 11 Home. Hardware: Intel i9, 32 Gb; Roland Integra-7, Presonus 192 & Faderport 8, Royer 121, Adam Sub8 & Neumann 120 monitors.
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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Joined: May 2005
Posts: 1,992
Expert
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matt.
one of the reasons ive been looking at the biab/rb combo is ..
to follow up on your comment re drum software..
such drum software alone can cost several hundred dollars.
and all one gets is drums.
so my thinking was , if i'm gonna spend THAT MUCH it seems to me
that biab/rb is a better value cos not only is one getting drum realtraks
but lots of other real instruments as well.
yes ive followed on various forums where people are spending oodles on just drum
software. it doesnt make sense to me when biab/rb offer more instruments.
and daw software n auto accompany n lots of other features thrown in to boot.
frankly i feel some of the opposition to this type of software might be coming
from people who feel certain sections of their livelihood under threat.
but i feel its unstoppable imho.
technology will continue to impact the status quo hugely.
i personally view the realtraks feature as just the start of something very big.
with more powerfull computers on the horizon i foresee a day when
one can incorporate any real instrument one wants in a song or orchestral
instrument. ie in a very dynamic fashion .
gonna be an exciting 10 yrs imho.
on a side note i really wish pg would advertise more n get the word
out more to musicians on what one can do with this software.
cos some people just dont comprehend its power n versatility.
retired puter engr....powertracks on amd......NICE !
"what is the black art of audio engineering ?"
my silly songs...motagator.com/bmanning
see my tips in the tips section.
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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One more thing that hasn't been mentioned is that since the playing of the Real Track players is at such a high level, they may not want their name mentioned with anyone at a lower level. Just a thought. Later, Ray
Asus Q500A i7 Win 10 64 bit 8GB ram 750 HD 15.5" touch screen, BIAB 2017, Casio PX 5s, Xw P1, Center Point Stereo SS V3 and EWI 4000s.
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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Joined: Dec 2007
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A very valid point, Ray.
Let's just be grateful that PG Music has given us the opportunity to "play" with some of the best musos around, and enjoy!!
Cheers,
Keith
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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But if the RT players didn't want to be associated with us in any public way, why did they allow their names to be linked to their work, along with a capsule bio, in the RT window? I haven't looked, but has Peter put into the license we purchased a restriction on the citation of these players in any liner notes? If not, there is no legal restriction in listing their names.
Harvey talked about song demos to Nashville and his advice is valid whether musicians record in his studio or we use the RTs. But if I want to release a new album (that sells peanuts on CDBaby and iTunes) and I list the names of the RT players in the credits, I don't see any any restriction on doing that, assuming it is not in the license I bought. (I have a law degree, so bear with me!) If I list the players as "Jim Jones, bass guitar, Tom Wheeler, electric guitar, and Ginny White fiddle, courtesy of PG Music," what is wrong with that?
Finally, who looks at credits anymore in a downloadable, iTunes world?
Just asking some questions.
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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Posts: 38,502
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As I've said before in this thread, you can do whatever you want to do. If you want to list names, do it. I wouldn't do it on my work, for several reasons. Most which have already been covered in this thread, if not by me, by someone.
But nobody is trying to prevent anyone from doing it, at least, not on this thread that I'm aware of.
--Mac
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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Here's an interesting scenario. You record an album using Real Tracks, acknowledge the musicians that helped create the Real tracks, and release the album. Someone compliments the Real Tracks musician on the work he did on "Bill Smith's" album. He replies "I've no idea what you're talking about...... I do not know "Bill Smith" and I certainly did NOT work on his album." Just a chuckle!
Cheers,
Keith
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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My 2 cents . . . we all agree that PG Music puts out a wonderful product that is getting better day by day with the help of their great session musicians, and as a loyal customer and fan I am grateful for both. But unlike a karaoke track or a cd with the vocal removed those of us who are using the product either performing live or doing demo tracks do the rest which includes the arranging and producing of the final product. I am fortunate enough to play anywhere from 65 – 85 gigs in a given year so from time to time I get the occasional question, (mostly from other musicians in the audience) “what are you using for backing tracks”? I show them the computer screen and tell them it is a wonderful composing and arranging piece of software from PG Music, give them the website and just as importantly the forum information along with my endorsement and thank them for asking. However (no knock on the karaoke or other DJs of any sort) but there are just as many people ask if I am using a karaoke program, my answer is “not even close.” If they persist I show them the program by bringing up a blank/new screen/chart in BIAB and explain that while BIAB has some wonderful tools this is the start, it is not a finished product i.e. a karaoke program already fine tuned (wherever they do that) or a CD done by a wonderful orchestra for Dino, Frank, Satchmo or Nat and all I did was remove their vocals. If they still persist, I ask them if they are in show business? They say no, and then I tell them to get their ass off of my stage rim shot! Acknowledgement: For fellow musician inquiries I talk about the software and session musicians, as they know the bottom-line is while PG Music provided the wonderful tools someone still has to put produce, arrange and play the show. Are there audience members who can do the same show I am doing with BIAB, yes the aforementioned musicians, but a resounding NO to the civilians who asked if this is a karaoke program. Bottom-line . . . even when I am touting BIAB and the session musicians to fellow musicians I don’t use their names. Not out of any disrespect but the blunt answer is they don’t care who they are, they just care if they can play man. (and that they can) Later,
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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Quote:
If they still persist, I ask them if they are in show business? They say no, and then I tell them to get their ass off of my stage rim shot!
Nice one, Danny!
I've done this too but I am more careful about it now since the punters can get quite belligerent around here
Follow That Dream Sam Karaoke King -------------------- Turning that corner again - I have to keep following that dream, no matter what
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Ask sales and support questions about Band-in-a-Box using natural language.
ChatPG's knowledge base includes the full Band-in-a-Box User Manual and sales information from the website.
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XPro Styles PAKs require Band-in-a-Box® 2025 or higher and are compatible with ANY package, including the Pro, MegaPAK, UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, and Audiophile Edition.
New! Xtra Styles PAK 20 for Band-in-a-Box 2025 and Higher for Windows!
Xtra Styles PAK 20 for Windows & Mac Band-in-a-Box version 2025 (and higher) is here with 200 brand new RealStyles!
We're excited to bring you our latest and greatest in the all new Xtra Styles PAK 20 for Band-in-a-Box! This fresh installment is packed with 200 all-new styles spanning the rock & pop, jazz, and country genres you've come to expect, as well as the exciting inclusion of electronic styles!
In this PAK you’ll discover: Minimalist Modern Funk, New Wave Synth Pop, Hard Bop Latin Groove, Gospel Country Shuffle, Cinematic Synthwave, '60s Motown, Funky Lo-Fi Bossa, Heavy 1980s Metal, Soft Muted 12-8 Folk, J-Pop Jazz Fusion, and many more!
All the Xtra Styles PAKs 1 - 20 are on special for only $29 each (reg $49), or get all 209 PAKs for $199 (reg $399)! Order now!
Learn more and listen to demos of the Xtra Styles PAK 20.
Video: Xtra Styles PAK 20 Overview & Styles Demos: Watch now!
Note: The Xtra Styles require the UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, or Audiophile Edition of Band-in-a-Box®. (Xtra Styles PAK 20 requires the 2025 or higher UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, or Audiophile Edition. They will not work with the Pro or MegaPAK version because they need the RealTracks from the UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, or Audiophile Edition.
New! XPro Styles PAK 9 for Band-in-a-Box 2025 and higher for Windows!
We've just released XPro Styles PAK 9 for Windows & Mac Band-in-a-Box version 2025 (and higher) with 100 brand new RealStyles, plus 29 RealTracks/RealDrums!
We've been hard at it to bring you the latest and greatest in this 9th installment of our popular XPro Styles PAK series! Included are 75 styles spanning the rock & pop, jazz, and country genres (25 styles each) that fans have come to expect, as well as 25 styles in this volume's wildcard genre: funk & R&B!
If you're itching to get a sneak peek at what's included in XPro Styles PAK 9, here is a small helping of what you can look forward to: Funky R&B Horns, Upbeat Celtic Rock, Jazz Fusion Salsa, Gentle Indie Folk, Cool '60s Soul, Funky '70s R&B, Smooth Jazz Hip Hop, Acoustic Rockabilly Swing, Funky Reggae Dub, Dreamy Retro Latin Jazz, Retro Soul-Rock Fusion, and much more!
Special Pricing! Until July 31, 2024, all the XPro Styles PAKs 1 - 9 are on sale for only $29 ea (Reg. $49 ea), or get them all in the XPro Styles PAK Bundle for only $149 (reg. $299)! Order now!
Learn more and listen to demos of XPro Styles PAKs.
Video: XPro Styles PAK 9 Overview & Styles Demos: Watch now!
XPro Styles PAKs require Band-in-a-Box® 2025 or higher and are compatible with ANY package, including the Pro, MegaPAK, UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, and Audiophile Edition.
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