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What's the best way to send an audio track file so it's easiest to line up with the other tracks for the person receiving it??? I'm using bigfiletransfers so that's not the question.  The hassle is lining up the tracks - I've had difficulty on both ends - sending and receiving - to get them to line up right with the other tracks. So please be specific LOL - abc... I hope that's clear. Thank you for your help.
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I record a new track along with the track(s) I am sent, and my track(s) and theirs all always start at the beginning of the song as they defined it, including a long lead-in. When I send my track back, I include theirs, so if there is any question, they will know what I intended by lining up their own tracks. This is a very legit question, since some DAW software supports time stamps but some does not.
Another way to say this is, if my part is a punch-in, or short segment in the middle of the song (like a jazz solo), I still bounce it to a full-length track so what I give them is an audio file that starts when all their other tracks do.
I also send them an MP3 of MY mix so if there is any question, they can hear exactly what I intended. Of course, when people hire me for tracks, I never know how they might chop my part up! Comes with the job...
If you are on the receiving end, and get tracks that do not all start at the beginning of the song, then expand your view of the audio files horizontally, look for beats to match up vertically between tracks, and do your best, with your ears as your final guide. I have also been known to ask them to redo their track to start at the beginning, as described above.
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Quote:
Another way to say this is, if my part is a punch-in, or short segment in the middle of the song (like a jazz solo), I still bounce it to a full-length track so what I give them is an audio file that starts when all their other tracks do.
ditto
another tip is: add a click track that can be removed later.
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Thank you Matt. Follow up questions: If I receive an mp3 - when I open it in RB it decompresses the file. So if I then send a wav back in return it should line up with their original wav if they didn't shorten it for the mp3?
A while back when I sang a little part mid song for Russ he had me record a few seconds of silence at the beginning and then something about clicking on "consolidate" - honestly I can't remember the exact procedure - is that necessary in RB? Because the last track I sent I just selected (highlighted) the whole track and exported it to a wav.
So far with wavs or mp3s, this lining things up is frustrating. I do make an mp3 of my mix and the timing is on the money......
Would putting a couple of bars intro of drum beats for a count in or something help whether or not the receiving daw has a time stamp capability?
Thanks again.
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Don,
I was typing while you were answering. I'm assuming the originator would have to be the one to send the click track along with the other tracks?
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Its the mp3 formatting that is giving you grief. It's known that different mp3 engines generate differing amounts of silence at the beginning, and to make it worse some remove a bit during decompression to compensate, so it can get messy. If you both use the same codec it shouldn't be an issue, but there are a bunch of codecs out there. Having the click, even for just the first bar *should* make it easier to realign.
Safest way is to work with waves, or ape files that decompress to exact copies. Or Flac.
Using Track - export track to file should work as long as you answer yes when it asks to include silence at beginning.
I do not work here, but the benefits are still awesome
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Yes, as rharv said, this is most likely an mp3 codec fault. Different mp3 codecs put differing amounts of data at the beginning of the file, which makes the lineup not come out right when opening again in another program or place.
*This can be solved by placing an audio event such as a countin sticktap, or at least a handclap, recorded, at the beginning of every track at the exact same place on the timeline before converting and sending. Then the person on the other end has to line up those starting events manually after they import the tracks.
Sending .Wav files makes for larger filesizes, but eliminates that particular problem. Use of one of the .wav programs that make the filesizes smaller is a good idea here.
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Quote:
This can be solved by placing an audio event such as a countin sticktap,
This is what I've used. Some mp3 encoders change the length. The click track will help things line up.
Mick
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Hi Mick, maybe I’m just unlucky but I have had some MP3 files with a count in not line up no matter what I did. A couple would start ok but go off toward the end. I only use wav, Flac or Ape files now. With a count in I’ve never had a problem with them.
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Josie,
If the Tempo is correctly set in a DAW, it *should* line up with any other DAW, with the same tempo. As long as the music was recorded in time.
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Quote:
Hi Mick, maybe I’m just unlucky but I have had some MP3 files with a count in not line up no matter what I did. A couple would start ok but go off toward the end.
Now that you mention it...I've had that happen too.
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Josie (and others commenting on using an MP3), I want to clarify that when I said this:
"I also send them an MP3 of MY mix so if there is any question, they can hear exactly what I intended."
I did not mean that I intend them to use that track in the mix, for the timing reasons given by others. I only send .WAV files. The MP3 is only so if they did not understand where my trumpet was supposed to come in, for example, they can hear it clearly on my MP3. It's only a double-check and should not even be needed.
Hope that helps a little.
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Trax, I'm not sure what you mean. If I import a file the tempo sets automatically I thought.
Thanks for all the great help on this subject. I understand things much better now. Waves and clicks or clicks and flacs sounds like a good idea to me. The mp3 seems unpredictable - possible - but too time consuming in the overall.
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MP3 files are condensed files, so you may get some timing issues because of the compression that takes place to MP3 from wave. I thought you were importing standard wave files at 16/44.100, my bad. I always use wave files when working on collaborations via www.
If you are importing into RealBand or PT, you would want to know the original BPM Tempo that the person used during their recording. Otherwise, you are doing the job of the ACW, so to speak.
I hope you are not working with something where they pressed the record button and just started recording? Sorry if I misunderstood what you are trying to do.
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Josie, I've experienced this problem more than once. BAck about a year or more ago when I recorded my last CD project, I had some files that had this issue. TRAX is right... MP3's can sometimes cause this... it's not really their fault, after all, they ARE condensed files.
What I found that works best... is: WAV files. I used one of the big file sharing services to swap WAV's back and forth. Mind you, now, I did get some MP3 files that DID work... but when they didn't I had to switch to the LARGE WAV files to get them to sync properly.
I also had problems sometimes if other collaborators only recorded at a start and stop point in the song. It's best that if they are going to play on the 2nd verse, for example... have them hit record at the beginning of your song, and just sit back and listen and then when it's time for them to come in... have them come in and play, sing or whatever. That always worked WELL for me. WAV is the best. I've even heard good reports on WMA files, but I generally always stuck with WAV files.
Best wishes for best recording!
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You can save upload/download time by using one of the two free lossless audio compression schemes. MonkeysAudio or FLAC. These will take a mix that was 50meg and make it about 27 meg, then when decompressed at the other end it is an exact copy of the wav file. The Monkeysaudio one is extremely fast (takes a few seconds per song) and saves minutes of upload time.. good for people on limited connections. It will take a vocal track from 50 meg down to about 10 meg because of all the silent parts on the track, they get super compressed for size. Just another tool to know about - http://www.monkeysaudio.com/Wonderful when doing CD size projects.
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oh yeah. I forgot about those.
MONKEY'S AUDIO is my fave. I need to check; I bet I'm using an OLDER version.
It's a great tool, but it does require both collaborators on both ends to know how to use it.
Not that it's complicated --- it's easy. But it is a consideration. I've bumped into folks
that didn't have it and didn't want to install it so........... bummer....... had to do something else.
Go MONKEY AUDIO!!! Yeah!
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Hi Sundance,
I actually experimented with this same scenario recently and it worked. First of all, establish the tempo of the song and the time signature (2/4, 4/4, 3/4 etc). I sequenced a song on the sequencer of my Yamaha Motif ES 2 days ago. I was just working on a quick demo for a client of mine. Anyways, the tempo of this sequence is 95 BPM and the time signature I used is 2/4. After the song was completed, I recorded the song as an audio file into Sonar 4 which I have on my laptop. Before I recorded I had my midi cables etc and everything hooked up correctly, had Sonar as the Master and the Motif as a slave (Midi Sync-wise) and I set up Sonar to record in 2/4 time and I also set up Sonar's tempo to 95 Bpm. One more thing, I set up Sonar also to record AUDIO
Maybe some one else in here might have a different way of doing it but for me the result was perfect. The Audio file recorded in Sync and the measures fell in line / 1, 2 / 3, 4 / 5, 6 / 7, 8/ etc etc etc. I allowed a 1 bar count at the beginning....so the first bar / 1, 2/ was the count and the music started on / 3, 4/. I could change the way the song started if I want and make the music begin on / 1,2/ but I wanted the song to breathe a bit at the beginning. Again, this is just me. Some one else may not want a 1 bar count but like I said, it can be changed and or adjusted easily the way I have the audio recorded.
Everything recorded perfectly and I can now send this audio file to any one with any kind of DAW.......be it Cubse, Digital Performer, Logic Pro, Ableton etc................and the audio file will be properly lined up in measures.
I hope I have somewhat answered your question. Hit me back.
JAH BLESS.
Jacobins
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Quote:
and I can now send this audio file to any one with any kind of DAW.......be it Cubse, Digital Performer, Logic Pro, Ableton etc.........................and the audio file will be properly lined up in measures.
Ya wanna know how I know you didn't read the thread?
This is not always true, which has been attested to by quite a few people in this thread.
Different mp3 codecs (not wav or raw audio) on one machine can make things get off. It happens (thus this thread).
Something to watch for. Mp3's will work most of the time, but not always.
So other compression tools are available.
That's the thread in a nutshell.
/I hope you have a sense of humor mon/
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Rharv Monn !!
Hahahaha. Yeah I do have a sense of humour. Well Rharv, ummmmmm what about just wav files (not MP3 files)? I mean, I have been working with a few studio guys in Boston. They use DIGITAL PERFORMER and I set up my audio files like I described above. If these guys need me to record the audio at 96k......a higher bit rate.....then that I will do and any other specifics they want me to pay attention to.................but always, Mon, Rharv...............always..............my audio wave file tracks line up like a breeze into DIGITAL PERFORMER for these guys over there in BOSTON. We never had any issues.
So, it's interesting....isn't it?
Jacobins
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