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Does such an animal exist? For audio files, I've just been plunking keys on the piano until I figure out the key. I'm not a piano player and I would rather have a faster way of finding the correct key the tune is in. If only I had perfect pitch..... Is there any software that does this? Thanks for any info.
Stan
Cornet Curmudgeon
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Its really not that difficult to do by ear. I think you will find this faster than any software. The key of a passage or piece is the note that 'closes' or ends the piece. Most songs end on a troic chord that is a chord which has the key note as the root - unless you get that 'left hanging' feeling its going to be the root. The melody too comes to a satsfying end on the key note. Be careful often a song can change key - particularly at the bridge (the second 'different' section).
There is a good ear training software called Earmaster, it has a free trial download or used to.
If you think you have the key figured out and you find you dont, try the note a fifth down. Its quite easy to mistake the fifth for the root.
Zero
Win 11 64, Asus Rog Strix z390 mobo, 64 gig RAM, 8700k
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Quote:
Does such an animal exist? For audio files, I've just been plunking keys on the piano until I figure out the key. I'm not a piano player and I would rather have a faster way of finding the correct key the tune is in. If only I had perfect pitch..... Is there any software that does this? Thanks for any info.
Stan
Absolutely! It's called Band in a Box or Real Band. Both have the Audio Chord Wizard-ACW. It can be hit or miss with the actual chords but it's very good at giving you a road map of the song and the bass notes and like Zero said that last bass note in the song is usually the key. Also click on the "Ear Training" icon in Biab. It's very good at helping you hear intervals and then the key itself. It's true that literal perfect pitch is a gift however you can get very close with practice.
Bob
Biab/RB latest build, Win 11 Pro, Ryzen 5 5600 G, 512 Gig SSD, 16 Gigs Ram, Steinberg UR22 MkII, Roland Sonic Cell, Kurzweil PC3, Hammond SK1, Korg PA3XPro, Garritan JABB, Hypercanvas, Sampletank 3, more.
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Quote:
Does such an animal exist? For audio files, I've just been plunking keys on the piano until I figure out the key. I'm not a piano player and I would rather have a faster way of finding the correct key the tune is in. If only I had perfect pitch..... Is there any software that does this? Thanks for any info.
Stan
Hi Stan,
Take a look at the last note of the sheet first. Especially the bass or lowest note written.
That will be the note of the key signature 99% of the time.
How to find the key if no sheet available and you are listening? -- Start concentrating on only the lowest notes you hear, typically the bass. Then try to match the bass note with your instrument.
The bass is the foundation, so it is worth its weight in gold to start training your ears to listen to the bass part in order to get not only the key signature, but eventually you should start hearing the chord structures as well, along with the chord changes.
--Mac
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Thanks for those good points. I've been trying to get the key by just listening to sections after the intro. However, as Zero says, there could be key changes during the song that I could miss--been here done that, too. As to ACW, it just hasn't worked for me. Maybe it's because there hasn't been enough data in the songs I chose to use it on. I've read many posts wherein folks haven't had good luck with it. Maybe it works better on audio files than it does on midi? It certainly won't hurt me to learn to do it better by ear and maybe it's better that way. I'll try that last note trick for sure, too. Again, thanks for your comments.
Stan
Cornet Curmudgeon
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I play guitar and usually I just pluck the notes on the third string one by one going up and down. WHen You hit the note that is the key of the song you will know that it is right,it just seems so. Sometimes I can get a bit mixed up as the firth of the scale will have a lot of tone in common with the root, usually takes me less than 10 secs to get the key of a song on my guitar just by using the above method and I have a bad ear for knowing intervals that kind of thing, but finding the key is not that difficult usually.
The above method will work for backing a singer too, just tell them to start singing and go up your third string of guitar until you find note that tonal wise fits in with what they are singing(will work on other instruments as well as paino)
joe
joe
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Quote:
Maybe it works better on audio files than it does on midi?
Stan, it's called the Audio Chord Wizard. It won't work with midi. Biab or RB has had for years the the midi chord wizard. With biab you have to tell it in the midi import window to extract the chords while RB does it automatically. Depending on how the complex the song is the chords can still be off either way. Many times it's best to pick and choose the tracks to apply it to. If the piano part is complex, maybe the guitar part is simpler so try just guitar and bass. Some files the string section is the simpler part. These things are decent tools but nothing replaces your ears.
Many times if you're having problems with a song you can find the chords on the internet just by typing in the name of the song and the word "chords" then load the chords into Biab. Of course these are just things some random person posted on a website, they could still be wrong.
I'm sure you know you can change keys easily in Biab once you have the chords in. If you really have to, listen to the recording of the song with some headphones from whatever source while playing back Biab using your studio monitors and adjust the key sig until you find it. Of course if the recording is not exactly in tune and is "in the cracks" that can really mess with your head.
Again, it's really all about your ears, practice using Biab's ear training tool and none of these potential problems will matter.
Bob
Biab/RB latest build, Win 11 Pro, Ryzen 5 5600 G, 512 Gig SSD, 16 Gigs Ram, Steinberg UR22 MkII, Roland Sonic Cell, Kurzweil PC3, Hammond SK1, Korg PA3XPro, Garritan JABB, Hypercanvas, Sampletank 3, more.
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Thanks. I know that it's an audio chord wizard. I forgot to mention that I saved the midi to audio before using the chord wiz. Yep, I've had my hear messed with using some recordings. Given the amount of time I spend on determining the key, I'm not sure the ear training tool will help much, but I'll give it a try. Appreciate your help.
Stan
Cornet Curmudgeon
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pgmusic uses a much different system for "Get Chords from MIDI file" routine.
Since MIDI data already contains the actual notenames, it is a lot different from trying to get a machine to decipher the complex waveforms of audio file and then analyze and convert to pitch from frequency, then take all of that and analyze and convert to chords.
The Audio Chord Wizard works best on simpler songs, attempts to use it on jazz, etc. songs where the chords often have extensions - and the bass moves at slightly different times - can have not so great results. ACW can get confused rather easily when confronted with these things. It also likes a nice CLEAN audio file as well. The level of the file seems to be as important as anyting else, too. Sometimes if the level is too high, ACW has trouble. Likewise if the level is too low. There's a Sweet Spot and it changes from recording to recording.
Sometimes finding a good MIDI file to download and using that Get Chords command can yield the chord for a song faster - and more accurately.
--Mac
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