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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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Joined: Oct 2011
Posts: 17
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OP
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Joined: Oct 2011
Posts: 17 |
Hi folks... about to pull the trigger on UltraPAKPLus - really looking forward to the RealTracks stuff I've been hearing in the demos...
I'm waiting for the annual Christmas sale, so in the meantime I borrowed a buddy's older version - that just has the MIDI engine...
I'm looking for some tutorials on doing copy/paste editing - mainly to try and insert intro's and outro's to existing jazz standards. If someone wants to send me a link or two that might explain how it works, I'd appreciate it... I'm struggling...
Specifically, I'm trying to use the "Copy Chords and/or Melody" dialog box... the song is currently a 32 bar form with a 2 bar ending... I'm trying to add a 4 bar intro... so:
Copy From Bar#: 1
Numb. Bars to Copy 34
Copy to Barb #: 5
That approach would work on most sequencers that I've work with - but does not seem to work here... i'm probably missing something simple...
Cheers!
Rob
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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Joined: May 2007
Posts: 1,616
Expert
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Expert
Joined: May 2007
Posts: 1,616 |
I would just insert 4 bars at the beginning of the song. The others will be moved for you.
R
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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Joined: Oct 2011
Posts: 17
Enthusiast
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OP
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Joined: Oct 2011
Posts: 17 |
Yea... just learned that - as well as the "Intro Bars - auto-generate"... still this copy/paste menu/dialog is a mystery.
Thanks for your help!
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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Joined: Oct 2011
Posts: 17
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OP
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Joined: Oct 2011
Posts: 17 |
Hmmmm... I'm also getting some unexpected behavior with Edit > "Erase From... To...". I'm trying to erase the last two bars of the track... and it simply won't.
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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Joined: Sep 2007
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BIAB is not a sequencer in the sense that you are thinking of. Although it looks like and has some of the functions of a sequencer, it is a unique music creation program with unique characteristics. The final two bars is a prime example. These are reserved for BIAB endings exclusively and cannot be edited within BIAB. Other differences include the the limited number of tracks and a 255-bar limit for song length.
To make the kind of changes you are trying to do you need the companion program Realband (RB), which is included in the purchase price with BIAB. RB is a sequencer (here often called a DAW, or Digital Audio Workstation) which incorporates some of BIAB's unique features. RB provides 48 tracks, unlimited song length, the ability to make comprehensive edits, and much more.
HTH,
Richard
"My primary musical instrument is the personal computer."
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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Joined: Oct 2011
Posts: 17
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OP
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Thanks Richard... and I understand everything you stated... cheers!
I guess same goes with "tags" - it seems that if there is a tag - it won't let you erase bars... that's fine... sorted it out.
Still - when one selects "Erase From...To" - and you select bars that belongs to a tag or an intro - it should probably tell you can't delete those bars as they are "managed" by BIAB directly...
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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Joined: May 2007
Posts: 1,616
Expert
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Expert
Joined: May 2007
Posts: 1,616 |
The Erase function will work on tags and intros. Keep in mind that tracks other than Melody and Soloist are automatically generated by BIAB. Erasing the auto tracks won't do any good unless you Freeze the track after Erasing - otherwise they will be re-generated the next time you hit Play. If you use the 2 bar endings, those are also auto-generated.
R
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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Joined: Jun 2005
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As has been said, Biab is not a sequencer and you haven't said what version your friend has. If it's too old, he won't know anything about freezing tracks. It sounds like you're working with a midi file not a Biab song. When you load a midi file into Biab you can then tell it to extrapolate the chords from it but they may or not be very accurate depending on how complex the song is. Jazz tends to be complex and one thing people don't understand is chords are not part of the midi standard. This is strictly a function of Biab and Real Band. They have the ability to analyze a midi file and make pretty good guesses as to the chords but many times you still have to look at the chord grid and make corrections.
If you are working with an existing Biab song then trying to edit a song you didn't create and therefore you don't know exactly what went into creating it is a tough job for a noob to try to figure out in a day or two. What Biab is really known for is you creating a brand new song from scratch by selecting the style and entering the chords.
Instead of us taking you into the deep water trying to explain how to do something as specific as this, just tell us what you want to accomplish with Biab and we can tell you if it will do it or not. If we say yes it will then just buy it and it can take you some time to work with it to make it do what you want but at least you know it will do the job.
One big thing I always try to tell potential buyers is Biab is not designed to create exact covers of classic songs because no matter how well done style tracks are they're not going to create that classic piano intro to Joy Spring for example or the horn licks for Tunisia.
Bob
Biab/RB latest build, Win 11 Pro, Ryzen 5 5600 G, 512 Gig SSD, 16 Gigs Ram, Steinberg UR22 MkII, Roland Sonic Cell, Kurzweil PC3, Hammond SK1, Korg PA3XPro, Garritan JABB, Hypercanvas, Sampletank 3, more.
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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Hi Rob, Here's a link to some video tutorials that might also be of use. http://www.pgmusic.com/videos.bbwin.htmSimply scroll down to the "Video Archives". Hope you enjoy the BIAB adventure as much as I did  Regards, Noel
MY SONGS...Audiophile BIAB 2026
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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Joined: Jul 2002
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Band in a Box Wiki is an encyclopedia about everything related to the award winning music software from PGMusic . Articles on how to use BiaB, recording with BiaB, styles, composing, tips and tricks, bugs and workarounds are all encouraged. http://bandinabox.wikia.com/wiki/Band_in_a_Box_WikiPG support page http://www.pgmusic.com/support.htm
Lenovo YOGA 900 Window s 10 Home 64bit M4 pro Mac mini 1tb HD 24GB mem casio wk7500 presonus audiobox i2 usb interface
casio wk-7500
biab & realband 2025 everything pk both with Current builds
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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Joined: Oct 2011
Posts: 17
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OP
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OK... based on some comments here I should state the following...
I'm trying to evaluate a current version that has only MIDI - because - I think the Real Tracks demos that I've heard on the site are *really great* (I've been telling everyone about them too) ...and I'm ready buy the "full meal deal" if I can accomplish what I want.
However... my evaluation is based on taking existing BIAB songs - jazz standards - and modifying them in order to generate professional jazz backing tracks. The target is to create bass/drums/piano backing tracks for me and my wife. (I'm a guitar player and she is a singer.)
So...I'm not really interested in generating solos or melodies - although I would not mind having the melody there... at least while the tracks are being developed.
I've been playing jazz for a while and more importantly, I'm a pretty serious MIDI programmer and did it professionally before it became mainstream. I'm a DAW specialist as well - starting way back when AMS Audiofile was the only game. I'm currently a WaveLab beta tester (since version 3) and was a Nuendo/Cubase beta-tester for a number of years...
Yet I'm seriously struggling with this program. Doing the most basic tasks seem to be completely counter-intuitive. Example: when is "copy/paste" *NOT* "copy paste"? But here's the thing: most of these issues I could NOT care less about! ...because of the uniqueness of the software. Nonetheless... I do have to accomplish my task.
So, I've been doing some pretty simple experiments - open a basic standard.... create an intro... then, head in - a couple of choruses for solos - head out... a nice tag/outro. I'd like to leave the melody there for the head in/out - but get rid of it for the solo section. Generate the tracks and then import them in Nuendo for finishing. That's it.
You would think this would be simple! Yikes. Creating a tag and testing it is a real chore because if I have 4 choruses and the tag comes in at the middle of the last one, I have to play the song from beginning to end. If I try to locate before the tag - how does it know that its the 1st chorus or the 4th? When I add more choruses - and it asks to "Adjust Melody to fit the # of choruses" - it seems to mess it up if I have a tag. Even deleting the melody where I want solo sections seems to be a chore... at least relative to a sequencer.
So with all the great resources that you've posted above - and thanks for that! BUT... I'm seriously weighing the BIAB approach against hiring a couple of guys for a day, and have them play a pile of standards in my MIDI rig instead. It might be about the same amount of money but WAY less time. What's holding me back is the "promise" of what BIAB might provide in combination with Real-Tracks... I guess right now I'm just frustrated - this stuff usually comes pretty easy for me.
Thanks for your support.
Rob
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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Joined: Sep 2007
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I don't have time to answer your note point by point, but do want to point out that BIAB is ideally suited to exactly what you want to do. Also, there is a quick way to get to the tag without having to listen all the way through.
Good luck, and welcome to the community,
Richard
"My primary musical instrument is the personal computer."
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 12,808
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Quote:
.
You would think this would be simple! Yikes. Creating a tag and testing it is a real chore because if I have 4 choruses and the tag comes in at the middle of the last one, I have to play the song from beginning to end. If I try to locate before the tag - how does it know that its the 1st chorus or the 4th? .
So with all the great resources that you've posted above - and thanks for that! BUT... I'm seriously weighing the BIAB approach against hiring a couple of guys for a day, and have them play a pile of standards in my MIDI rig instead. It might be about the same amount of money but WAY less time. What's holding me back is the "promise" of what BIAB might provide in combination with Real-Tracks... I guess right now I'm just frustrated - this stuff usually comes pretty easy for me.
Thanks for your support.
Rob
Rob, BIAB has a learning curve. You do have to have the time to invest to get to a point of smooth efficient workflows. Also, there are significant changes twice each year in functionality, so if you have an old version you will be missing out. For example in current version of BIAB you simply R-Click on any bar (x) and then select "Play from Bar x Chorus x". Most of us have gone though the pains, heck even to this day (after more than a decade of use) I come here to vent at times, but ... nothing else on the market does what this program does.
BIAB – 2026, Reaper (current), i7-12700F Processor, 32GB DDR4-3200MHz RAM, Motu Audio Express 6x6 - My SoundCloud.
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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Quote:
...., so in the meantime I borrowed a buddy's older version - that just has the MIDI engine...
Rob, just how old is this version?? Oh, and welcome to the forum. 
BIAB – 2026, Reaper (current), i7-12700F Processor, 32GB DDR4-3200MHz RAM, Motu Audio Express 6x6 - My SoundCloud.
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