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RealBand
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Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 114
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OP
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Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 114 |
I have a song I am using mostly RTs on and I wanted more punch out of the drums but every effect I used either ruined the kick or the snare, just couldn't have my cake and beat it too. I though I'd try a little experiment today. I saved the drum track from BIAB to stereo wave and then loaded into RB where I seperated the file into two seperate wav tracks then added EQ and compression to enhance the kick on one track and enhanced the snare on the other...WOW!!!! what a difference, a significant increase in presence without clipping with crisp snappy snare on one channel and pumping bass on the other, ironically it add amazing resonence and a stereo pan to tom fills...way too cool, but I bet a lot of you already new this
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RealBand
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Joined: May 2000
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There ya go.
You should also locate and download a good "MultiBand Compressor" plugin and give that a shot.
A Multiband Compressor is simply a good parametric EQ in front of a compressor in the same box (or virtual plugin "box").
With that we can sculpt out an area of the frequency band of interest or disinterest and then compress or expand just that area. Typically it can be done with at least three sculpted bands in the same plugin all in one shot.
There are limits as to what can be done, of course, watch for (actually listen for) the longer duration events as they can spill over into unwanted regions and be problematic. Not the same as having separated tracks for each instrument of the trapset, but we can still manage to do quite a bit of gentle sculpting and change things that way to suit the mix if not the desire.
--Mac
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RealBand
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Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 114
Apprentice
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OP
Apprentice
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 114 |
Quote:
There ya go.
You should also locate and download a good "MultiBand Compressor" plugin and give that a shot.
A Multiband Compressor is simply a good parametric EQ in front of a compressor in the same box (or virtual plugin "box").
With that we can sculpt out an area of the frequency band of interest or disinterest and then compress or expand just that area. Typically it can be done with at least three sculpted bands in the same plugin all in one shot.
There are limits as to what can be done, of course, watch for (actually listen for) the longer duration events as they can spill over into unwanted regions and be problematic. Not the same as having separated tracks for each instrument of the trapset, but we can still manage to do quite a bit of gentle sculpting and change things that way to suit the mix if not the desire.
--Mac
I have the WAVES "Platinum" set of plugins but I'm still trying to figure out what they all do. I think the "Audio Track" does what you suggest, it's a EQ, compressor/limiter all in one, I'll have to try....holy crap there's so much to learn 
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RealBand
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Joined: May 2003
Posts: 8,021
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Joined: May 2003
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There was a post on how to separate the RD. I suggested doing exactly as you did for all instruments. I use a Sound Forge Multi-band compressor.
I play country and it's imperative that the kick drum & bass play the same rhythm. I'm the bass player. Another little trick is to open the RD folder and find the kick drum that goes with the RD style, ie If you use Nash even8 open that folder. Slice a sample of the kick. Bring into your audio editor and again multi band compress to isolate just the kick. Use this sample in any available drum synth or soundfonts. Write a style with just kick drum as you want it. In RB edit the original drum track to hide the kick. Change all bb tracks to regular tracks. Choose the style you made. Rt click a track and add a midi track and choose drum. Voila!
PS I did this from the top of my head. Not at the music computer. You get the gist.
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RealBand
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Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 94
Enthusiast
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Enthusiast
Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 94 |
Quote:
There was a post on how to separate the RD. I suggested doing exactly as you did for all instruments. I use a Sound Forge Multi-band compressor.
I play country and it's imperative that the kick drum & bass play the same rhythm. I'm the bass player. Another little trick is to open the RD folder and find the kick drum that goes with the RD style, ie If you use Nash even8 open that folder. Slice a sample of the kick. Bring into your audio editor and again multi band compress to isolate just the kick. Use this sample in any available drum synth or soundfonts. Write a style with just kick drum as you want it. In RB edit the original drum track to hide the kick. Change all bb tracks to regular tracks. Choose the style you made. Rt click a track and add a midi track and choose drum. Voila!
PS I did this from the top of my head. Not at the music computer. You get the gist.
Man that sounds like a lot of work...8)
How effective has it been for you, could you post an example so I could hear it please....
cheers
Wiz
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RealBand
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Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 7,697
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Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 7,697 |
A lot of work compared to what? Compared to hiring a real drummer, setting him up is a real studio with $100,000 (or more) of top notch recording equipment, hiring a recording engineer to do the session, then hiring a mixing engineer to put it all together and finally sending it out to a mastering house for the final product? That kind of work? Once people get past the learning curve of just getting their computers set up properly, then about 90% of all the posts here are about how to get a sound as good as a pro studio would get. If that's what you're interested in, then yeah, it's a lot of work. What Silvertones is describing is pretty much standard procedure if that's what it takes to get the sound he wants without breaking the bank. There's software available that will do exactly what we're talking about here. Melodyne will do it and so will the new Emulator X3. I was just reading about that one since I have the original Emu X. X3 has some kind of beat slicer that will take an audio drum track, breakout the individual drums and put them on a midi track. Cool, but it's $200 for me to upgrade or $500 for a first time buyer. I already have some killer sampled drum kits with Jamstix so I don't know if this function of X3 is worth it to me or not. I'm going to wait for some user reviews before I decide about it. I'm pretty sure Silvertones doesn't want to spend that kind of money either, so it's off to the salt mines and some work to get what we want.
Bob
Biab/RB latest build, Win 11 Pro, Ryzen 5 5600 G, 512 Gig SSD, 16 Gigs Ram, Steinberg UR22 MkII, Roland Sonic Cell, Kurzweil PC3, Hammond SK1, Korg PA3XPro, Garritan JABB, Hypercanvas, Sampletank 3, more.
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RealBand
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Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 8,109
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Cool trick. Thanks for posting!
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RealBand
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Joined: May 2003
Posts: 8,021
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Sorry I don't have anything to post. I don't write and find myself more interested in the techy side of things. Always looking for something different to tackle such as the above. Work? sure but fun. That's why I so look forward to each BETA of the programs.
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RealBand
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Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 8,707
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I am hoping that RB will address the issues with VSTi's that have timing features, like Jamstix, where we can allow the drum track to be spilt into 8 tracks and then we can get some very top notch drum tracks.
HP Win 11 12 gig ram, Mac mini Sonoma with 16 gig of ram, BiaB/RB 2026, Reaper 7, Harrison Mixbus 11 , Presonus Audiobox USB96
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RealBand
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Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 7,913
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Joined: Jan 2002
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Robh and jazzmammal, I know you guys have Jamstix. Have you ever got it to simply play along with a PG track? If so, then you might be able to make it 'Jam' by automating the jam level. I did this recently in a song I knocked out a week or so ago for the FAWM challenge. It wasn't jamming along well with the audio, so I simply drew in the jam level with automation. Here's the result: http://rockstarnot.rekkerd.org/fawm2009/Scott%20Lake%20-%20Lunch.mp3Note that on the first verse, the snare gets replaced with a side-stick, etc. Verse 2, I dialed up the jam level. This might actually work in PG products.
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RealBand
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Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 8,707
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I would love to know more about this cause i can't get it to do anything but be a drum machine with PG stuff.
HP Win 11 12 gig ram, Mac mini Sonoma with 16 gig of ram, BiaB/RB 2026, Reaper 7, Harrison Mixbus 11 , Presonus Audiobox USB96
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RealBand
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Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 7,697
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Yep, that's still a problem. Peter said during the last beta test they were aware of it and are working on it but nobody's heard anything new since. It's a VST implementation thing and you would think it would be an easy fix but I guess not. I don't understand why the delay but I'm not a programmer. It's just that there's several freebie VST hosts floating around (they're listed on Rayzoon's website if anyone's interested) that seem to handle Jamstix just fine and Reaper's had it since day one too so how difficult can it be if free open source developers can work easily with VST implementation? I'm guessing that since Power Tracks was not designed to work with VST's in the first place, it's must be really hard to integrate it after the fact.
Bob
Biab/RB latest build, Win 11 Pro, Ryzen 5 5600 G, 512 Gig SSD, 16 Gigs Ram, Steinberg UR22 MkII, Roland Sonic Cell, Kurzweil PC3, Hammond SK1, Korg PA3XPro, Garritan JABB, Hypercanvas, Sampletank 3, more.
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RealBand
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Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 8,707
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Cakewalk was originally a DX based program, just like PTPA is, and it took a couple of versions to begin to really impliment VST. At first it was a wrapper, then a built in wrapper, then the next years it was susposed to be native, but i beleive it took one more year for it to be truely native VST.
So I want them to get it right, so it will be good when it happens.
Can a VST mini host be used in PT or RB to run these plugs? and if so how?
HP Win 11 12 gig ram, Mac mini Sonoma with 16 gig of ram, BiaB/RB 2026, Reaper 7, Harrison Mixbus 11 , Presonus Audiobox USB96
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