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I am transcribing a piano part for a song I recently wrote. I am using GuitarPro 6 to "git-r-done" (I am a guitar hack). Does the highlighted section work, or is it too confusing?  The left hand is straight forward, but the right is playing a "C" chord that also contains the melody for the measure. The up stems are the melody and the down stems are accompaniment / harmony. Is there a better way of notating this? Title edited for clarification.
Last edited by RobbMiller; 02/25/12 10:44 PM.
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Hi RobbMiller,
The only thing I would do is change the first dotted crotchet E to a crotchet. Unless you had the pedal on, the dotted E couldn't be still held down when you had to play the quaver E with the stem up. The effect will be the same, the decay from the notes in that middle register is long enough to cover it.
All the best.
Edited for additional thought.
The second dotted crotchet C should more accurately written as a quaver tied to a crotchet. This would make the notation correct for 4/4 time as the beats are clear and more easier to count.
Last edited by yjoh; 02/25/12 06:04 PM.
yjoh
[i]Music...a joy for life.
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This is not a composition question, strictly speaking it is a transcription issue.
The Bass Clef part looks fine.
In the Treble Clef, the first beat has a three-note chord, but the highest note is not dotted like the lower two. Place a dot after the G to go along with the dots after the C and E.
Following that C triad is a G and here we have a rhythm notation problem. Since the first half of the beat is dotted, which means that it takes half again its duration value, that second note cannot be an 8th note as written. Change that to be a sixteenth by adding the little extra bar at its top.
So the first beat you should now have a dotted eight followed by a sixteenth note. That is, I'm hoping you are not sincerely asking someone to play the duration of the C and E notes with the dot while playing two straight 8's above at the same time. That would be a strange situation.
From here on it is impossible to predict what you are trying to say rhythmically, as it could go in one of two different directions.
Right now, the alto line, the Cs, do not have four complete beats shown for them. Either an 8th rest is missing, or there is more attempt at syncopation here than what you want to hear. I'd vote for the second case as being what would be easiest on any musician to play, pianist, guitarist or otherwise.
I'm thinking that the most likely scenario would be to change that single dotted C that is under the G, to the same configuration as the G notes above it. 8th note tied to a dotted quarter.
That would mean you would have to change the last C to an 8th note.
But you may want to hear something else, can't tell.
--Mac
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Yjoh and Mac, Thanks for your input. I revised the measure based on your input.  Hopefully I didn't make matters worse. The two transcriptions sound almost identical played via MIDI. As this is aimed a 4th year student player, I am trying to be a clear as possible with my limited knowledge of piano. @Mac: I changed the title of the thread from composition to transcription -- thanks.
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The Treble part is lacking an 8th beat. Measure must have four full beats incorporated to be 4/4 time.
You could simply insert an 8th Rest between the dotted figure and the last two 8th notes, but again, I am not sure what it is you want to hear.
For student level, I'd likely lose the dots and place a full Quarter Rest between them.
--Mac
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Hi all, Thank goodness Mac was able to help with this. After I submitted my last post I was wiped out with a migraine and couldn't get back to offer a better solution than the one I gave (which was not altogether accurate anyway) While I was laid up I came up with this instead, which should be well within a 4th year students ability. I've just done away with any voicing issues but as Mac has said it may not be the effect you're after. [image]http://  [/image] I'm still not too good at adding images to my posts but at least it's there. All the best. 
yjoh
[i]Music...a joy for life.
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This version is the easiest to read also. Later, Ray
Asus Q500A i7 Win 10 64 bit 8GB ram 750 HD 15.5" touch screen, BIAB 2017, Casio PX 5s, Xw P1, Center Point Stereo SS V3 and EWI 4000s.
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Yjoh,
I am sorry you were not feeling well.
I cannot see the image you posted. It appears as a black rectangle that states the image no longer exists. I would love to see your solution.
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Hi RobbMiller, I can see the image in the post and Ray can as well I think so I don't know what has happened. I am posting a better suggestion (3rd time lucky!) so it's probably better if the previous one hasn't shown up for you. I'm in between students at the moment so a quick post and then I wont be able to check back until later this evening. I hope this image is ok. All the best and thanks for the well wishes. [image]http://  [/image]
yjoh
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If the image hasn't shown for you again the notes in order are as follows:
C chord(CEG) as quavers, G quaver, E quaver, C and G quavers tied to C and G crotchets then C quaver, E quaver.
Hope it's not too confusing, I'm so glad we have staves to write on.
Must go. Will check in later.
yjoh
[i]Music...a joy for life.
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Thanks Yjoh! That is perfect.
I am still unsure why the eighth tied to the quarter (quaver tied to crochet) is better than the dotted quarter. But I am quite sure you understand piano students much better than I.
Thanks,
Robb
FYI: The second image is fine, but the first is still as described.
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What Yjoh posted last is how I would have expected to see it.
John Laptop-HP Omen I7 Win11Pro 32GB 2x2TB, 1x4TB SSD Desktop-ASUS-I7 Win10Pro 32GB 2x1.5TB, 2x2TB, 1x4TB SATA BB2025/UMC404HD/Casios/Cakewalk/Reaper/Studio One/MixBus/Notion/Finale/Dorico/Noteworthy/NI/Halion/IK http://www.sus4chord.com
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Quote:
..But I am quite sure you understand piano students much better than I...
Well, it is not piano specific.
Proper notation is proper notation, regardless of instrument.
*Always check each measure carefully to make sure that the number of beats per bar does not get violated or truncated.
*Use of dotted notes is primarily reserved for syncopation but bear in mind that the majority of music is not syncopated.
*Whenever a figure is in doubt, do not trust MIDI softwares to notate a recorded line properly. Sometimes they do and sometimes they don't. Sometimes you can look at published musics to study a bit of the rules in these situations.
That last example posted is good and is an "easy read" - If it sounds like what you want, go with it.
--Mac
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Hi everyone,
So glad to have been of help. I'm not sure that I understand piano students any better than anyone else, I suppose I've always liked theory and I'm dealing with it all the time.
As Mac said proper notation is proper notation. Looking through scores and even working through some graded theory books would you help a lot.
The "theoretical" reason for the quaver tied to the crotchet has to do with one of the the "rules" of grouping quavers.
That is: in 4/4 time when quavers are involved,the middle 2nd and 3rd beats can't be joined.
eg. you can't have a crotchet followed by 4 quavers all joined together and then another crotchet. The 4 quavers should be separated in to 2 groups.
(As a by the way the stem on the C and G in the bass staff should really go down, this is all to do with the middle line. Theory rules again. So many of them!)
A good little book that might be of some help is Alfred's "Essential Dictionary of Music Notation". I've found it to be really useful.
This has been an interesting exercise,keeps the old grey matter working. LOL
All the best
yjoh
[i]Music...a joy for life.
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Thanks again for the assistance. The rough score went home with the three young pianist today. I hope they find it easy enough to smile.
Thanks also for the book recommendation. It has found its way to my Amazon cart.
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Hi Robb,
Glad to have helped. The missing image is my mistake I'm afraid. I thought once you had added an image to a post it was permanently there. When I posted the last image, I deleted the other one as it wasn't needed. I must be careful not to delete any images I post from now on. Oh well, live and learn!
All the best
yjoh
[i]Music...a joy for life.
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