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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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hi - when I try and create songs from scratch, they don't sound anywhere near as good as the demos...
any quick tips on how to see what exactly is loaded up and playing in the demo tracks (specific patches, real tracks loaded, drums/other elements being used)?
I figure if I can look deep into what exactly's going on in the demo tracks, I can better create new ones from scratch.
my favorite demo so far is the tenor bebop jazz one:
_JZBOPTS Bebop Quartet demo
All-RealTracks BeBop Jazz Quartet with Tenor Sax Soloist being backed by Piano, Acoustic Bass and Drums.
Tempo = 150 - 220
_JAZZBOP.STY. BeBopTrio, Ac.Bass & Pno(190 RS)
All RealTracks. Trio.
RD: JAZZ: a: HiHat b: Ride & Snare :Craig Scott
RT752: Bass, Acoustic, Jazz BeBop Sw 190 , Neil Swainson
RT755: Piano, Acoustic, Rhythm Jazz BeBop Sw 190 , Miles Black
not sure how to load up all those things, the 2 RTs and the RD into one song, so it all comes out sounding like the demo..?
thanks -
ken
p.s. I'm still astonished that this program can randomly generate good-sounding real-sounding tenor jazz sax solos on the fly, that's a remarkable feat that should be on CNN or something, it's really incredible. I mean hit GenPlay and get a new randomly generated solo in real track that sounds good....really? i wouldn't believe it if I wasn't doing it here myself. just amazing. brilliant.
Last edited by kenjazz; 05/11/13 04:32 PM.
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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Hi kenjazz,
What is it in particular that doesn't sound good?
It would help greatly to narrow it down here, as to what you think is the problem.
For example, is it a case of perhaps a different tonality, fullness of sound, or is it a case where what the instruments are playing perhaps does not seem to fit, etc.
There would be a different approach to each different aspect.
--Mac
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So load a demo song you like, clear out the chord grid and enter the chord progression of your song. The sound you get is all about the style selected; however, the PGMusic demo songs generally have a melody track, so you might also try listening to the demo with the melody track muted, just to see what the accompaniment sounds like. That's the same type of sound you should get with your own songs.
Otherwise, if I remember correctly, PGMusic doesn't do anything to tweak the songs they post. Pretty much just selecting the style, entering a melody and/or sol, then hitting play.
John Laptop-HP Omen I7 Win11Pro 32GB 2x2TB, 1x4TB SSD Desktop-ASUS-I7 Win10Pro 32GB 2x1.5TB, 2x2TB, 1x4TB SATA BB2025/UMC404HD/Casios/Cakewalk/Reaper/Studio One/MixBus/Notion/Finale/Dorico/Noteworthy/NI/Halion/IK http://www.sus4chord.com
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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That has been my experience also -- the PGMusic demosongs are NOT tweaked or made to sound better via "outside" methods.
However, there may be a setting somewhere that is causing your rendered songs to sound differently and that's where the importance of you coming back here and better defining what it is that is different about your own songs is going to help clear this up. This could be anything from a gain staging problem, easily rectified with some settings changes and better understanding of how to do that, to perhaps selecting the wrong Style file for the task at hand and ending up with some undesired "extra" notes in your chords. Or any one of several other things.
For the record, my own results come out sounding very much as rich and full as the PGMusic Demo Songs do, after understanding and using some of the settings for soundcard, DXi Rendering, the BB mixer, etc. and I don't typically have to change settings from song to song in order to have that happen.
--Mac
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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hi - thanks guys... from what the demo looks like, for example is there multiple styles/things loaded, to make it sound the way it does?
for example looking at the information, it says
song title: All RealTracks - Bebop Quartet
_JAZZBOP.STY. BeBopTrio, Ac.Bass & Pno(190 RS)
All RealTracks. Trio.
RD: JAZZ: a: HiHat b: Ride & Snare :Craig Scott
RT752: Bass, Acoustic, Jazz BeBop Sw 190 , Neil Swainson
RT755: Piano, Acoustic, Rhythm Jazz BeBop Sw 190 , Miles Black
so does that mean to replicate that sound, it's layering, using individually-loaded RT patches for different parts? not sure on how to replicate from scratch that type of sound...
eg Step 1: enter chord progressions
Step 2: pick a style from the style picker (_JAZZBOP.STY)
Step 3: right click on "soloist" at top bar and choose 'select best soloist real tracks' and choose tenor sax, eg 758
hitting the genplay button, it creates a song, but it doesn't play nearly as good as the demo, if you choose "load demo song", so I'm missing something... sorry I'm new to the program, trying to figure out how to get songs set up like the demo ones are.
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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Hi Ken,
A couple of thoughts spring to mind as to why the style doesn't sound as good when you generate it. It might be that the tempo is not the best tempo for those Realtracks. It might also be that the chords you have entered are not as adventurous as those used for the demo.
Regards,
Noel
MY SONGS...Audiophile BIAB 2025
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Or it might be that you are unhappy with what the Soloist selected is playing.
I still don't know what the exact problem is here.
--Mac
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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hi - thanks; I'll make a recording to show the difference... it's just operator error I'm sure; I'll keep trying.
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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Hi again, Ken.
As I suspect you're already discovering, BIAB is a fantastic program. My experience is that the best way to understand how it works is to get in and get one's hand's dirty (metaphorically speaking).
It would be great to hear your recording. That will help a great deal with understanding your issue.
Regards,
Noel
MY SONGS...Audiophile BIAB 2025
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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hi - thanks; I'll make a recording to show the difference... it's just operator error I'm sure; I'll keep trying. That's the spirit, kenjazz. Over the years, I have found out that Band in a Box is like learning a completely new and different "instrument" in and of itself, and the same sort of problems arise that one would encounter if they were to try adding a new and different musical instrument to their arsenal. Imagine the things that a consummate reed instrument player would have to contend with when picking up, say, a guitar and attempting to make music with it. In one aspect, the reed player would be ahead of the game, in the sense that things such as notation, counting, rhythmic figures, etc. would be things that are already developed. But on the other hand, the kind of things that would be necessary to master about playing the completely different instrument are going to take some time and repetition, study and understanding before that new instrument becomes a dependable asset. There is a forum regular around here for many years who recently passed away who said it best: If Band in a Box could be mastered in a day or two, the program wouldn't be worth the purchase price. (I'm paraphrasing here, the late John C. had his own wonderful usage of the English language in these forums, but that is the gist of it.) When I first had an early copy of Band in a Box, way back when pgmusic had not even added Audio to the thing, a MIDI-only auto-accompaniment program, I did not really use the program very much if at all. Tried it out, didn't get results that were good sounding enough and left it to languish. It was not until some time later, maybe more than a year, that I decided to sit down with the program and try to really make it work for me, entering the chords to a particular song that I needed to woodshed. That began the true learning curve for me, as I got enough of what I needed out of the program at that time to have an auto-accompaniment in order to streamline the practicing of the particulars, to include working out the improvisation of solos. I then started trying to make that happen for other tunes and along the way learned quite a bit as to the methods, features, tips and tricks needed in order to become a seasoned PGMusic practitioner. And, the learning never ends, it seems, as PGMusic manages to come up with so many New Features to add to this wonderful music tool, every year. Sometimes every half year. Take your time, work with it, play with it, don't let the frustration of self-imposed "deadlines" get in the way. Sometimes putting the thing to bed for awhile and coming back to it makes all the difference in the world. And, as I found out many years ago here, this forum is a dynamite place to share the experience, making the learning of this New Instrument much more fun than trying to scope it out on my own. I hope you find out the same. The most important aspect, IMO, is Peter Gannon's own motto: "Have Fun," Having FUN with Band in a Box is likely the best path to getting past initial learning curves, moving into "user" status and continuing on to "superuser" status IMO. And after working out and having fun with this marvelous program for a bit, you will likely enjoy the looks on the faces of the *other* cats you've been playing live with when they hear the differences in your playing and soloing from the bandstand. --Mac
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outstanding insights, Mac... much appreciated. I'm completely impressed with the software, i guess just trying a lot of stuff would be the way to go, and follow along w/all the tutorials.
my main reason for getting it is to make backing tracks I can mix in cakewalk/sonar with my live sax playing, to make youtube videos...and do it with copyright-free arrangements I've "authored" on my own by typing in chords into biab and having it generate real-track guitar/piano/drum backing, for bebop/classic jazz tunes... it's the perfect program for that, to export .wav files I can do audio mixdowns with, as the base, to play via headset as I record sax bits into a mic, then mix it all w/reverb/compression in sonar/vegas/whatever.
i remember back in the day using my commodore-64, 30 years ago, with some basic midi program, and how much fun that was. now biab with it's ability to spontaneously generate fresh tracks that sound good, for use as backing, is a huge move forward... looking forward to getting up to speed on it... thx for the insights :-)
Last edited by kenjazz; 05/13/13 06:50 PM.
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Ken,
If no one has said this already, welcome to the community. You've gotten advice from the best of the best here, mainly because you are musically literate and are asking great questions. We look forward to watching and helping you grow. Adding BIAB to your arsenal may take you and your playing to another level, as it has for me and countless others.
Some thoughts on workflow. BIAB is in many ways the ultimate shiny thing. I recommend trying to learn one thing at a time, BUT take notes as you go as far as what you might want to learn next, because answering one question will raise many others. Then prioritize what you come up with and continue on your merry way. Of course, put to use what you learn as you learn it so it 'sticks.'
BIAB is an amazingly deep program which, if you didn't know experientially, a cruise through some of the menus, submenus, and sub-submenus would confirm. It is VERY easy to become distracted. Having ADD myself, I have gone as far as writing down particular goals and keeping them in front of me as I work so that I can stay on task. Over time you will find what works best for you.
HTH,
Richard
"My primary musical instrument is the personal computer."
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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Hi Richard, thanks so much for the encouraging words, I really appreciate it. Agree it's amazingly deep, tons of features to learn... and well worth it.
Good point about goals, one action item I'm going to do is create some biab tutorials w/camtasia for youtube, as I learn it, to document how to do simple tasks, like "set up a 12-bar blues progression and "trade 4s" w/realtracks type of project.
Looking forward to the journey... the older I get if I don't record it/write it down, if I step away for a couple months I'll totally forget it, so that's why i'm going to make a series of 6-12 video tutorials, which will help w/memorizing it, how to do things.
thx,
Ken
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New RealTracks Released with Band-in-a-Box 2025!
We’ve expanded the Band-in-a-Box® RealTracks library with 202 incredible new RealTracks (in sets 449-467) across Jazz, Blues, Funk, World, Pop, Rock, Country, Americana, and Praise & Worship—featuring your most requested styles!
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These RealTracks includes “Soul Jazz” with Neil Swainson (bass), Mike Clark (drums), Charles Treadway (organ), Miles Black (piano), and Brent Mason (guitar). Enjoy “Requested ’60s” jazz, classic acoustic blues with Colin Linden, and more of our popular 2-handed piano soloing. Plus, a RealTracks first—Tango with bandoneon, recorded in Argentina!
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We’ve added new RealTracks across bro country, Americana, praise & worship, vintage country, and songwriter piano. Highlights include Brent Mason (electric guitar), Eddie Bayers (drums), Doug Jernigan (pedal steel), John Jarvis (piano), Glen Duncan (banjo, mandolin & fiddle), Mike Harrison (electric bass) and more—offering everything from modern sounds to heartfelt Americana styles
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- Look Ma! More MIDI 13: Country & Americana
- Instrumental Studies Set 22: 2-Hand Piano Soloing - Rhythm Changes
- MIDI SuperTracks Set 44: Jazz Piano
- Artist Performance Set 17: Songs with Vocals 7
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In this PAK you’ll discover: Minimalist Modern Funk, New Wave Synth Pop, Hard Bop Latin Groove, Gospel Country Shuffle, Cinematic Synthwave, '60s Motown, Funky Lo-Fi Bossa, Heavy 1980s Metal, Soft Muted 12-8 Folk, J-Pop Jazz Fusion, and many more!
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Note: The Xtra Styles require the UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, or Audiophile Edition of Band-in-a-Box®. (Xtra Styles PAK 20 requires the 2025 or higher UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, or Audiophile Edition. They will not work with the Pro or MegaPAK version because they need the RealTracks from the UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, or Audiophile Edition.
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We've just released XPro Styles PAK 9 for Windows & Mac Band-in-a-Box version 2025 (and higher) with 100 brand new RealStyles, plus 29 RealTracks/RealDrums!
We've been hard at it to bring you the latest and greatest in this 9th installment of our popular XPro Styles PAK series! Included are 75 styles spanning the rock & pop, jazz, and country genres (25 styles each) that fans have come to expect, as well as 25 styles in this volume's wildcard genre: funk & R&B!
If you're itching to get a sneak peek at what's included in XPro Styles PAK 9, here is a small helping of what you can look forward to: Funky R&B Horns, Upbeat Celtic Rock, Jazz Fusion Salsa, Gentle Indie Folk, Cool '60s Soul, Funky '70s R&B, Smooth Jazz Hip Hop, Acoustic Rockabilly Swing, Funky Reggae Dub, Dreamy Retro Latin Jazz, Retro Soul-Rock Fusion, and much more!
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Learn more and listen to demos of XPro Styles PAKs.
Video: XPro Styles PAK 9 Overview & Styles Demos: Watch now!
XPro Styles PAKs require Band-in-a-Box® 2025 or higher and are compatible with ANY package, including the Pro, MegaPAK, UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, and Audiophile Edition.
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Band-in-a-Box® 2025 for Macs®: VST3 Plugin Support
Video: Band-in-a-Box® 2025 for Mac®: Using VST3 Plugins
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