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But..............this one goes to 11!
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Classic. Now I'm gonna have to watch that again!
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Well so much for that.
I pulled out one of my acoustic-electrics to try the amp simulation software.
I installed the PG version of Amplitube and could not get it working with my Focusrite Saffire Pro 40. It would work with the onboard RealTek but the latency was horrid.
So I tried to run Guitar Rig 4 as a stand alone (I've used the Sonar plugin from time to time). I was playing around with the driver settings to see the different latency values and suddenly the Saffire Mix Control Reported "No Hardware Connected". I shut down GR and Rebooted the computer. Still no Saffire. I tried several other thing, but the only thin that put everything back to right was a to run system restore point from a few days ago.
So goes my trial with software so far. I'm thinking hardware may be more reliable.
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Robb,
That's weird. I also have Guitar Rig LE (the version that was on the cover DVD of Computer Music back in 2008 or 2009)
What has been your experience using ASIO drivers with the Saffire? I borrowed one that has the speaker emulation built in (Saffire Pro 24 DSP) and the mix control software was insanely complicated. So complicated that I never got it to work properly - that is, I couldn't get my mic or guitar signals in and be able to monitor through plugins. I was basically going to be allowed to keep it indefinitely. I gave it the college try for about 3 evenings - when I wanted to be doing some recording. I took it back to work and went back to my PreSonus Firebox. Then my recording lappy (Thinkpad Z61m) gave up the ghost and I gave up on firewire interfaces.
Bought a Tascam US-800 (several threads here about those dodgy drivers), but I have figured out a way to get that interface to behave most of the time - turns out is has a memory leak - so you have to save often, kill the driver, re-instantiate the driver and then carry on. Kind of a hassle, but at least it works.
Back to your thing - have you ever used an instrument level input into the Saffire? It sounds like it since you've used it with Sonar. What was the magic there?
Believe it or not with ASIO4ALL drivers, you can get really low latency out of most on-board sound cards, but you won't have the right kind of impedance matching to get good level and drive from the guitar.
Sorry if I've misled you...Trying to help you save a buck and a back
I will admit the Fender G-DEC 30 that my father-in-law bought this past January on clearance at Guitar Center was very tempting. I think he paid $220 for it. Now, that's a modeling amplifier with ability to play along with .mp3 files you load onto SD cards, can re-program the amp modeller (we converted his into the blues version of the G-DEC), headphone outlet for silent practicing, works as a recording interface, etc. I should have bought the other one that they had in stock.
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I am enjoying this thread, and I can feel how much fun you are having with the prospect of shopping around for new equipment. I sure enjoy this process, when I get to do it.
BUT - are you not perhaps putting the cart before the horse just a bit? I would think the first challenge will be to master the technique of chikn-pikn on the guitar. The time for shopping and tweaking the electronic sound comes after a fair degree of mastery is in place and in your fingers, is it not?
I would think that you have a little time to work on your chops. That gives you some leisure to shop around and try different things. Maybe put up insulation in the garage so you can wail all you want when the time comes.
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What has been your experience using ASIO drivers with the Saffire?
On Win7 64 bit, ASIO is the only option. My system has work flawlessly since replacing my Echo Mona last year.
[quote=rockstar_not]
Back to your thing - have you ever used an instrument level input into the Saffire? It sounds like it since you've used it with Sonar. What was the magic there?
No magic, it just works. The GuitarRig 4 plugin works there too. The problem was trying to use it as a stand alone app. At first this worked too. Then I tried playing with the bit rate to see what kind of latency I had. As soon as I changed the bit rate it stopped working.
Sorry if I've misled you...Trying to help you save a buck and a back
I don't feel misled, it is a good idea. I'm going to see if it works out inside Sonar.
I will admit the Fender G-DEC 30 that my father-in-law bought this past January on clearance at Guitar Center was very tempting.
Hasn't this been replace by the Fender Mustang Line of amps? I'm still looking at that Mustang Floor Pedal.
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BUT - are you not perhaps putting the cart before the horse just a bit? I would think the first challenge will be to master the technique of chikn-pikn on the guitar. The time for shopping and tweaking the electronic sound comes after a fair degree of mastery is in place and in your fingers, is it not?
Yes, but to learn the technique, you need the proper equipment... a proper guitar and a proper amp. That's all I'm looking for. The typical High Gain amp available everywhere would not be appropriate to learning the technique. Just looking for something suitable for learning (and still keep peace in the home). When my students ask me about learning acoustic guitar, I tell their parents not to go to Wally World and pick up the First Act guitar. Enjoyable and productive practice requires an instrument worthy of playing. I point them to a Baby Taylor or a Seagull. When folks ask me about wood working, I tell them to avoid the $89 Home Depot band-saw or table-saw. These create frustration rather than good technique. To learn good technique, you need good tools. I'm Just trying to start with the right tools.
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What do you think about this Super Champ? Nice tone (subjectively). https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FZ_UlefkBMcNot sure about the volume. Can you keep it low on this amp?
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Yes, the G-Dec was replaced by the new Mustang series, but from what I can tell, a small step backwards in capability came with it. The G-Dec series was almost too far of a step for the traditionalists to accept - it looked to digital and they actually had the audacity to use the word 'digital' in the name. I think that was a big part of the lack of success of that amp series.
For example, the G-DEC 30 used a 2 speaker (mid & low driver, tweeter) system which is needed for amp simulation and the built-in audio playback/practice capability. The similarly priced Mustang (the 40W version - is a 1x12")
G-DEC allowed you to flash the brain so that you could turn it into one of 3 or 4 different collections of amp simulations. The base G-DEC had lots of metal amp sims, not needed by my father in law, so we re-flashed it to be the blues model.
Like Mac stated above, get one with a headphone jack and the ability to turn off the cabinet - that will keep the peace better than any volume coming from the cabinet - that much is sure.
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...Then I tried playing with the bit rate to see what kind of latency I had. As soon as I changed the bit rate it stopped working. ? Changing the bitrate is not how to see what kind of latency you have. --Mac
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?
Changing the bitrate is not how to see what kind of latency you have.
I was trying to hear what impact increasing the sampling rate had on latency.
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?
Changing the bitrate is not how to see what kind of latency you have.
I was trying to hear what impact increasing the sampling rate had on latency. As for bit rate, 44100 or 48000 Hz, if available are really all that you need. Don't bother with anything higher if available. Buffer size is usually what affects latency. Also, some bit of tweaking of how Windows handles various processes may be in order - Focusrite forums/tech support should help there. I just found the mix control software to be very very complicated on the Saffire Pro 24 DSP. Too many choices/settings, weird routing configurations, etc. Granted this was about a year and a half to two years ago, so I can't remember all the details. I just remember I couldn't get a simple monitor through the VST to work reliably.  I remember I had a lucky combo that did work and of course I tweaked some more and lost it. I gave up on the thing. I don't give up easily, but it defeated me - at least for my attention span at the time.
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I just found the mix control software to be very very complicated on the Saffire Pro 24 DSP. Too many choices/settings, weird routing configurations, etc.
It did take some time getting used to -- especially the routing. However it is very flexible when you do. You can route any of 16 mixes to any available output. Which means I can have a different mix on each pair of headphones and an entirely different mix on the monitors. You can also record via "loopback" which allows you to use any audio on your PC as an input source.
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I read on another forum that the Twin Reverb is loud enough to do structural damage to your home and destroy all that you love.
I ordered a Mustang Floor from MF, made a phone call and got a extra 10% off the price which was already discounted 50%. I hope it is worthy of my Tele.
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I would go with the larger amp setup. It's Rock & Roll, right? 
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They all go to 11. 
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I read on another forum that the Twin Reverb is loud enough to do structural damage to your home and destroy all that you love.
I ordered a Mustang Floor from MF, made a phone call and got a extra 10% off the price which was already discounted 50%. I hope it is worthy of my Tele.
Robb, that seems like a good price. You'll get lots of use out of it and if you have to play out the XLR connectors will get you connected to the house in no-time. You might have to opt for some in-ear monitors to hear yourself loud enough in a live performance setting with drummer, bass, other amped instruments, etc. Your wife and your back will be very happy! With the Aux in, you should be able to play along with whatever practice tunes you can feed it. I see that this unit has the tuner button located in the 2nd row of button switches. With the Digitech RP-500 and Zoom B3 amp simulators I use when I'm playing electric guitar and bass guitar respectively, I've grown to like tap tempo and tuner controls on the front row of buttons - The Zoom B3 has the tuner accessible there, but the Digitech has the tuner farther back on the pedal, making a bit of a 'tippy toe' action when tuning. Fortunately, my electric stays in tune pretty well, but my bass seems to really react to room temperature swings, which we have in our church in the 5 hours between initial setup, run-through, and 2 different worship services on a Sunday. The B3 has the tuner right in the front row. Can keep the heel on the floor when you use it. You'll also be able to record directly from this, without having to contend with mic'ing an amp in the right place. I think this is probably the biggest benefit of recording with amp simulation - you don't need to have an expert knowledge of placing mics with guitar cabs, and you can record loud (as well as practice loud) and nobody is the wiser. The two or three tones in this track: https://soundcloud.com/rockstar_not/scott-lake-cerulean-sky were my lowly MIM Strat and Behringer V-Amp 2 simulation. It has fooled some 'tone snobs' asking me how I got both the clean rhythm parts as well the distorted lead sounds. The only post processing I did was a very light delay that I added to the recorded track on the last few bars of the lead at the end of the song. You'll have similar sounds at your disposal (probably even better) with the Floor. It's a pretty good deal as you get both an amp simulator and a recording interface. Let's hear some recordings now! -Scott
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They all go to 11. There's such a fine line between creative and stupid....
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