Log in to post
|
Print Thread |
|
|
|
|
Off-Topic
|
Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 8,075
Veteran
|
OP
Veteran
Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 8,075 |
This thread is a spinoff from another one in which Aleck said: The issue of whether music is an intellectual or emotional or aesthetic experience could form a blockbuster discussion all by itself. But I wouldn't take part, for reasons that follow.
It is moot from my point of view, because everything personal - and I mean every single thing - your thoughts, dreams, regrets, hopes, guitar licks, tickles, itches, pains, plans, etc. - issues from the squishy gray lump sitting inside your skull. Music is brain output of a certain type. Poetry, philosophy, mathematics are brain output. Charles Darwin said that the brain "secretes [these things] like the liver secretes bile."
Both Albert Einstein and Wes Montgomery are called geniuses. Einstein lived in an obscure world of mental objects; Wes was no man of intellect, but he also lived in a world of mental objects - his melodic ideas, which, like a virus, went on to infect thousands of future musicians. I'm one of them.
Now, no one shouts out "yeah!" during a Physics lecture, but they do at a Jazz club. Are the people at the Jazz club agreeing with something when they shout, "yeah!"? Or is it just another word for "good!", in which case, what is it that was good at that particular moment?
I'm not much interested in the question whether music is an intellectual or emotional or aesthetic experience because, to me, all are brain output with complicated cross-talk between the three experiences. Songs make people cry. The equations of modern physics do not. Why? Beats me.
what's YOUR point of view?
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Off-Topic
|
Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 8,075
Veteran
|
OP
Veteran
Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 8,075 |
I agree that EVERYTHING we do originates in the brain... but the it is also true that the brain addresses the same topic differently if it sees it as a logical question or an emotional one.
Studies show more left brain activity when solving analytical problems, and more right brain activity when involved in playful or emotional activities.
Creative decisions based primarily on a formula (such as musical scales) would probably stir the left brain... whereas creative decisons made "because it feels right whether it fits the formula or not" would probably be driven by the right hemisphere.
Whether this is a moot point or not becomes most important in the teacher-student relationship because research has also shown that people learn more easily from teachers whose teaching style matches the student's learning style
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Off-Topic
|
Joined: Aug 2012
Posts: 12,438
Veteran
|
Veteran
Joined: Aug 2012
Posts: 12,438 |
It is a mix/balance of all three - proportions dependent on what you are listening to and why. It's music.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Off-Topic
|
Joined: May 2000
Posts: 38,502
Veteran
|
Veteran
Joined: May 2000
Posts: 38,502 |
Yes, by definition it becomes a mix of all.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Off-Topic
|
Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 8,075
Veteran
|
OP
Veteran
Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 8,075 |
OK, Obviously a complex process consists of a mixture of stimuli. But there is a hierarchy, and depending on which is being prioritized the results will be different.
For example, a college kid furnishing his dorm room might rationally prioritize cost above all else, and end up with books stacked in shipping crates he got for free.
Later in life when cash isn't his biggest constraint, he might furnish his home with a variety of completely different goals: 1) to please his wife 2) to impress his colleagues 3) to please his senses
the point I'm making is that the exact same task gets handled differently when we approach it as a primarily analytical process as opposed to a primarily emotive process
I'll go so far as to say that Hendrix was probably NOT writings songs with music theory as his primary consideration
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Off-Topic
|
eddie1261
Unregistered
|
eddie1261
Unregistered
|
50/50. You need the intellect to be able to cohesively and cogently present something that elicits emotion. If your music is not both intellectual and visceral, you have fallen short. People listening to your writings need to be given both something to think about and something to feel. When you touch both of those senses, your song is a success. Whether it is 6 minutes long or 3:34. 
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Off-Topic
|
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 1,815
Expert
|
Expert
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 1,815 |
But if you can do it in 3 minutes instead of 6 minutes you are twice as successful! (ha, ha)
Intellectual or Emotional?? When it comes to art, then it is two sides of the same coin.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Off-Topic
|
Joined: Dec 2011
Posts: 3,347
Veteran
|
Veteran
Joined: Dec 2011
Posts: 3,347 |
Intellectual or emotional?
It think can probably be both, either together or in isolation, but for me it has to be emotional above all.
I won't listen to anything which is purely intellectual but devoid of soul, but on the other hand, I'm quite happy with something which moves me emotionally without necessarily being technically clever.
If I was a philosopher, I could think that anything which has the power to move me must, therefore, be clever in some sense, but this starts to make my head spin.
ROG.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Off-Topic
|
Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 8,075
Veteran
|
OP
Veteran
Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 8,075 |
Rog So far your reply is closest to what I'm looking for
Obviously music enters both realms, but I'm curious to hear how that works Itself out for each of us
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Off-Topic
|
Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 23,216
Veteran
|
Veteran
Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 23,216 |
Intellectual or emotional?
It think can probably be both, either together or in isolation, but for me it has to be emotional above all.
I won't listen to anything which is purely intellectual but devoid of soul, but on the other hand, I'm quite happy with something which moves me emotionally without necessarily being technically clever.
If I was a philosopher, I could think that anything which has the power to move me must, therefore, be clever in some sense, but this starts to make my head spin.
ROG. I agree! This reminded me of another thread that was about playing fast, running scales etc but with no melody; I can’t remember what thread it was. I personally don’t like music that is nothing but fast rifts and/or shredding instruments (guitar, sax, mandolin etc) with no melody, regardless of the genre. This does not move me however it may move someone else. I prefer a good melody. A musician who can combine a good melody with some technically challenging parts can really move me. Musicians like Miles and Coltrane come to mind. But some may find this boring. Thus the only correct answer to the question is the one you come up with.
Whenever I get something stuck in the back of my throat, I dislodge it by drinking a beer. It's called the Heineken Maneuver.
64 bit Win 10 Pro, the latest BiaB/RB, Roland Octa-Capture audio interface, a ton of software/hardware
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Off-Topic
|
Joined: Apr 2010
Posts: 5,139
Veteran
|
Veteran
Joined: Apr 2010
Posts: 5,139 |
I just try to keep them under 3 minutes. I leave the musical philosophy to the experts. 
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Off-Topic
|
Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 4,251
Veteran
|
Veteran
Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 4,251 |
Intellectual or emotional?
It think can probably be both, either together or in isolation, but for me it has to be emotional above all.
I won't listen to anything which is purely intellectual but devoid of soul, but on the other hand, I'm quite happy with something which moves me emotionally without necessarily being technically clever.
If I was a philosopher, I could think that anything which has the power to move me must, therefore, be clever in some sense, but this starts to make my head spin.
ROG. ROG saved me some typing since he hit the nail on the head. It's got to have soul. I can't define that, ...but I know it when I hear it.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Off-Topic
|
Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 2,610
Veteran
|
Veteran
Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 2,610 |
Music is all about emotions. In the creative process, emotions play the major part. Intellect comes in to make it all come together in a cohesive way to come up with a finished product.
My take, anyway.
Cheers, Mike My Music * Asus ROG Strix G15CF 32 GB DDR4 4TB HDD + 1 TB SSD NVIDIA GeForce RTX 3060 8GB Win 11 AKAI EIE PRO Sound Interface. BIAB/RB 2024 UltraPak Build - Latest
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Off-Topic
|
Joined: Aug 2011
Posts: 10,814
Veteran
|
Veteran
Joined: Aug 2011
Posts: 10,814 |
I think emotions rule the music world. Pride hearing your child's first recital, ear candy technical wizardry giving you pleasure, amazement at the clever turn of lyrics. It's all about emotions. Nothing can change your mood as fast as three minutes it takes to play a song.
Jim Fogle - 2025 BiaB (Build 1128) RB (Build 5) - Ultra+ PAK DAWs: Cakewalk Sonar - Standalone: Zoom MRS-8 Laptop: i3 Win 10, 8GB ram 500GB HDD Desktop: i7 Win 11, 12GB ram 256GB SSD, 4 TB HDD Music at: https://fogle622.wix.com/fogle622-audio-home
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Off-Topic
|
Joined: May 2008
Posts: 5,085
Veteran
|
Veteran
Joined: May 2008
Posts: 5,085 |
My POV is this.
Intellect is learning how to make music so you can share your emotions with others who will relate to the feeling in your music. That's why it's known as the universal language.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Off-Topic
|
eddie1261
Unregistered
|
eddie1261
Unregistered
|
But if you can do it in 3 minutes instead of 6 minutes you are twice as successful! Well, my success level at this point is ZERO..... I may not be twice as successful, but it I cut them in half I would have twice as many songs!!
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Off-Topic
|
Joined: Dec 2011
Posts: 3,347
Veteran
|
Veteran
Joined: Dec 2011
Posts: 3,347 |
Just one example of something which is a simple chord sequence, minimal instrumentation and yet, to me at least, strangely moving. If you've seen it before, it's possibly worth another go - if not I hope you enjoy it. If you're put off by Bruce Springsteen, try to watch until the other singers take over. Bob CF - I hope there's a bit of soul in this one for you my friend. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N1wg9jyvfN0ROG.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Off-Topic
|
Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 8,075
Veteran
|
OP
Veteran
Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 8,075 |
Just one example of something which is a simple chord sequence, minimal instrumentation and yet, to me at least, strangely moving. If you've seen it before, it's possibly worth another go - if not I hope you enjoy it. If you're put off by Bruce Springsteen, try to watch until the other singers take over. Bob CF - I hope there's a bit of soul in this one for you my friend. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N1wg9jyvfN0ROG. good example Rog. I really liked that
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Off-Topic
|
Joined: Mar 2004
Posts: 6,706
Veteran
|
Veteran
Joined: Mar 2004
Posts: 6,706 |
Just one example of something which is a simple chord sequence, minimal instrumentation and yet, to me at least, strangely moving. If you've seen it before, it's possibly worth another go - if not I hope you enjoy it. If you're put off by Bruce Springsteen, try to watch until the other singers take over. Bob CF - I hope there's a bit of soul in this one for you my friend. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N1wg9jyvfN0ROG. Sorry ROG . . . I could not get past Bruce. I'll try again later, maybe fast forward. Later,
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Off-Topic
|
Joined: Dec 2012
Posts: 958
Expert
|
Expert
Joined: Dec 2012
Posts: 958 |
Pat,
As usual, your ideas are fascinating.
Something I left out about the "gray lump of matter" is this: It has the power of understanding, not to say that other clever species are devoid of it, but our power is finite, just like theirs. There are things that I believe human minds will never understand. One of these is precisely how music can make people react emotionally. Songs - blasts of air - can make people cry.
The responses show that members recognize a mixture of intellect, emotion and aesthetics in music - with complex interactions between the three. What these interactions are and how they work, is what I'm saying is forever beyond human understanding. The mind lacks the horsepower to understand itself, to say nothing of the more fundamental question of how the soggy gray stuff conjures up the 3-D, technicolor "theatre of the real" that each of us lives in as conscious beings.
To conclude - and I ask readers who have not have this experience to take it on trust - I've heard musical passages (no lyrics) that made my knees buckle, made my heart ache, brought tears to my eyes. Or I might just shake my head, feeling a perfection that cannot be described in words.
Like poetry, music is supposed to express things that cannot be said with mere words. Do you think that one day how these processes work will be thoroughly understood at the neurophysiological level? Here's a simpler problem: Describe precisely - neurophysiologically - what happens just before a guitar lick in your head travels down two arms into the fingers onto the instrument and then out into the world.
Here's when I think any of these will receive answers: Not ever.
Aleck
Sweetwater Creation Station. BIAB 2018, Mixcraft 8 Pro Studio, Izotope Nektar 2, Ozone 8, KEYBOARDS: Kurzweil Artis 7, Crumar MOJO, Hammond XK-3, BASSES (fretted & fretless by Ibanez, LTD, Warwick. GUITARS by Guild, Gretsch, Ibanez, Eastwood (12 string)
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Ask sales and support questions about Band-in-a-Box using natural language.
ChatPG's knowledge base includes the full Band-in-a-Box User Manual and sales information from the website.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Video: Band-in-a-Box® 2025 for Mac®: VST3 Plugin Support
Band-in-a-Box® 2025 for Mac® now includes support for VST3 plugins, alongside VST and AU. Use them with MIDI or audio tracks for even more creative possibilities in your music production.
Band-in-a-Box® 2025 for Macs®: VST3 Plugin Support
Video: Band-in-a-Box® 2025 for Mac®: Using VST3 Plugins
Join the conversation on our forum.
Band-in-a-Box 2025 for Mac Videos
With the release of Band-in-a-Box® 2025 for Mac, we’re rolling out a collection of brand-new videos on our YouTube channel. We’ll also keep this forum post updated so you can easily find all the latest videos in one convenient spot.
From overviews of new features and walkthroughs of the 202 new RealTracks, to highlights of XPro Styles PAK 8, Xtra Styles PAKs 18, the 2025 49-PAK, and in-depth tutorials — you’ll find everything you need to explore what’s new in Band-in-a-Box® 2025.
Reference this forum post for One-Stop Shopping of our Band-in-a-Box® 2025 Mac Videos — we’ll be adding more videos as they’re released!
Band-in-a-Box 2025 for Mac is Here!
Band-in-a-Box® 2025 for Mac is here, packed with major new features and an incredible collection of available new content! This includes 202 RealTracks (in Sets 449-467), plus 20 bonus Unreleased RealTracks in the 2025 49-PAK. There are new RealStyles, MIDI SuperTracks, Instrumental Studies, “Songs with Vocals” Artist Performance Sets, Playable RealTracks Set 4, two new sets of “RealDrums Stems,” XPro Styles PAK 8, Xtra Styles PAK 19, and more!
Special Offers
Upgrade to Band-in-a-Box® 2025 for Mac with savings of up to 50% on most upgrade packages during our special—available until July 31, 2025! Visit our Band-in-a-Box® packages page for all the purchase options available.
2025 Free Bonus PAK & 49-PAK Add-ons
We've packed our Free Bonus PAK & 49-PAK with some incredible Add-ons! The Free Bonus PAK is automatically included with most Band-in-a-Box® for Mac 2025 packages, but for even more Add-ons (including 20 Unreleased RealTracks!) upgrade to the 2025 49-PAK for only $49. You can see the full lists of items in each package, and listen to demos here.
If you have any questions, feel free to connect with us directly—we’re here to help!
Band-in-a-Box 2025 Italian Version is Here!
Cari amici
È stata aggerate la versione in Italiano del programma più amato dagli appassionati di musica, il nostro Band-in-a-Box.
Questo è il link alla nuova versione 2025.
Di seguito i link per scaricare il pacchetti di lingua italiana aggiornati per Band-in-a-Box e RealBand, anche per chi avesse già comprato la nuova versione in inglese.
Band-in-a-Box 2025 - Italiano
RealBand 2025 - Italiano
Band-in-a-Box 2025 French Version is Here!
Bonjour à tous,
Band-in-a-Box® 2025 pour Windows est disponible en Français.
Le téléchargement se fait à partir du site PG Music
Pour ceux qui auraient déjà acheté la version 2025 de Band-in-a-Box (et qui donc ont une version anglaise), il est possible de "franciser" cette version avec les patchs suivants:
BIAB 2025 - francisation
RealBand 2025 - francisation
Voilà, enjoy!
Band-in-a-Box 2025 German Version is Here!
Update Your Band-in-a-Box® 2025 to Build 1128 for Windows Today!
Already using Band-in-a-Box 2025 for Windows®? Download Build 1128 now from our Support Page to enjoy the latest enhancements and improvements from our team.
Stay up to date—get the latest update now!
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Forums58
Topics84,304
Posts777,518
Members39,612
|
Most Online25,754 Jan 24th, 2025
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|