Previous Thread
Index
Next Thread
Print Thread
Go To
Page 1 of 2 1 2
#242991 03/07/14 08:05 AM
User Showcase
Joined: Dec 2012
Posts: 958
Expert
OP Offline
Expert
Joined: Dec 2012
Posts: 958
One of the world's guitar titans died a few weeks ago, a man who revolutionized flamenco guitar: Paco de Lucia.

A couple of Forum members have mentioned my quick hands and I call that a "Crocodile Dundee" moment. In the movie, Croc and his girl, visiting New York City, are accosted by a mugger brandishing a switchblade. Croc's girl gasps and warns, "He's got a knife!!" Croc says, " 'At? At's not a 'noif! 'Iss is a 'noif!" He pulls out this monster hunting blade and slices a Zorro cut through the mugger's shirt without touching any skin. Mugger runs for his life.

Now, why this story? You want to see fast hands on a guitar? I implore you to watch this video. Paco de Lucia is the one on the right, the only one of the three guitarists not using a pick. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k_5YZbmLI4c

These fellas make me look like molasses dripping inside a refrigerator. So, I can't offer up anything like Paco to pay homage. The closest I can come is just pulling out a nylon guitar and playing what I think is Wayne Shorter's darkest, most enigmatic creation. Paco de Lucia was very jazz influenced and I think he might have liked this:

RIO https://soundcloud.com/aleckrand/rio


Sweetwater Creation Station. BIAB 2018, Mixcraft 8 Pro Studio, Izotope Nektar 2, Ozone 8, KEYBOARDS: Kurzweil Artis 7, Crumar MOJO, Hammond XK-3, BASSES (fretted & fretless by Ibanez, LTD, Warwick. GUITARS by Guild, Gretsch, Ibanez, Eastwood (12 string)
aleck rand #242999 03/07/14 08:52 AM
User Showcase
Joined: Aug 2012
Posts: 12,686
Veteran
Offline
Veteran
Joined: Aug 2012
Posts: 12,686
Really nice one, Dean!

The nylon string guitar suits your playing style really well - sounds great!

Nice production and a good mix. Enjoyable. Smooth...

floyd

aleck rand #243026 03/07/14 02:00 PM
User Showcase
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 2,646
P
Veteran
Offline
Veteran
P
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 2,646
Very nicely played, well mixed and arranged, thanks for sharing!


My Tunes

Psalm 57:7 My heart, O God, is steadfast, my heart is steadfast; I will sing and make music.
aleck rand #243035 03/07/14 02:48 PM
User Showcase
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 4,494
Veteran
Offline
Veteran
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 4,494
Hi, Dean !

I listened to the Paco video and.....
I was so mesmerized that I had to watch
it till the very end !:))
I am not sure I will touch the guitar
for a while after that treatment !!

I still hold you for one of the best
guitar players in the world !:))

Rio is also just wonderful !:))
Gracias mi querido amigo !


Cheers
tu amigo
Dani

aleck rand #243069 03/07/14 05:47 PM
User Showcase
Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 20,710
Veteran
Offline
Veteran
Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 20,710
Dean, very sensitively portrayed. I reckon you have delivered this track really well.

The way Wayne used dissonant harmonies in his composing demonstrated his creative abilities to constantly push boundaries.

And a nice tribute, too.

Thanks for the listen.
Trevor


BIAB & RB2026 Win.(Audiophile), Sonar Platinum, Cakewalk by Bandlab, Izotope Prod.Bundle, Roland RD-1000, Synthogy Ivory, Kontakt, Focusrite 18i20, KetronSD2, NS40M Monitors, Pioneer Active Monitors, AKG K271 Studio H'phones
aleck rand #243085 03/07/14 08:30 PM
User Showcase
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 2,281
Veteran
Offline
Veteran
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 2,281
Very nicely done Dean. Yes, a great loss. Although IMHO not a purist as a Flamenco player, but surely learned from the bests in the world. He without a doubt had his own style leaning a lot toward progressive jazz. I've seen some of his performances and sometimes I wondered if he had more that 10 fingers!

Later

Mike B.


Music should be part of your life
http://www.soundclick.com/blackcatjazzcafeband
aleck rand #243151 03/08/14 10:15 AM
User Showcase
Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 2,888
Veteran
Offline
Veteran
Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 2,888
Hi Dean,

you need not hide behind the original.
This is superb playing.
I enjoyed everything.

Guenter

aleck rand #243216 03/09/14 05:39 AM
User Showcase
Joined: Dec 2011
Posts: 15,792
Veteran
Offline
Veteran
Joined: Dec 2011
Posts: 15,792
Nice tribute to a stellar musician whom I would have never known of had it not been for this post.

Enjoyed the playing and the arrangement. You've made me a fan of nylon strings.


Our albums and singles are on Spotify, Apple Music, Amazon Music, YouTube Music, Pandora and more.
If interested search on Janice Merritt. Thanks!
Our Videos are here on our website.
aleck rand #243234 03/09/14 08:22 AM
User Showcase
Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 23,932
Veteran
Online Content
Veteran
Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 23,932
Excellent musicianship there Aleck! Your guitar technique is second to none!

I have that CD you mentioned. You are right in the fact that those three are extremely fast guitarist. The problem is have with the CD, if I remember correctly, is that all of the songs sound the same! That is nothing but rapid rifts with few melodic lines. If I’m wrong I’m sure someone will let me know and I’ll give it another listen.


It takes courage for a man to admit his wife was wrong.

64 bit Win 10 Pro, the latest BiaB/RB, Roland Octa-Capture audio interface, a ton of software/hardware
aleck rand #243423 03/10/14 09:03 AM
User Showcase
Joined: May 2011
Posts: 4,335
Veteran
Offline
Veteran
Joined: May 2011
Posts: 4,335
Look Ma no pick. Great video. Very nice work on this song. You expand our musical horizons with every post. It is a great education just listening to your originals and covers. Thanks and keep up the beautiful work.

aleck rand #243425 03/10/14 09:11 AM
User Showcase
Joined: May 2000
Posts: 38,502
M
Mac Offline
Veteran
Offline
Veteran
M
Joined: May 2000
Posts: 38,502
Sounds like the stringbuzz of a Fretless Nylon in there, Aleck.


--Mac

MarioD #243433 03/10/14 10:35 AM
User Showcase
Joined: Dec 2012
Posts: 958
Expert
OP Offline
Expert
Joined: Dec 2012
Posts: 958
Mario,

You're a guy who knows how to hit the nail on the head.

With McLaughlin you can start at any point in any solo and hear a machine-gun burst of notes. At least that's what I hear. He does not seem to be a melodist as an improvisor. In other words, I can't imagine singing or even remembering any "licks" that might make me say, "yeah!" The only feature I can tell you about what I hear is that it's fast, not that it's, say, bluesy or Trane-like or has the same quality X that that other guitarist over there has, etc.

Paco, on the other hand, seems to deliver melodic ideas along with the speed. From my point of view, speed devoid of ideas is like a double-talk artist who can do it at high speed. So, er, whad 'e say?

Dean

Mac #243435 03/10/14 10:43 AM
User Showcase
Joined: Dec 2012
Posts: 958
Expert
OP Offline
Expert
Joined: Dec 2012
Posts: 958
Mac,

Now there's an idea: a fretless nylon. Every so often, I've heard of guys playing fretless guitars, or fingerboards that are scalloped instead of equipped with frets. Then there's Charlie Hunter who plays an 8-string guitar using a (nonparallel) fretting system that lets him play bass on the top three strings. Few have followed in these directions, though.

Aleck Rand (aka Dean Clark)

floyd jane #243861 03/13/14 09:04 AM
User Showcase
Joined: Dec 2012
Posts: 958
Expert
OP Offline
Expert
Joined: Dec 2012
Posts: 958
Floyd,

You have the ears to understand a tune like this, which I think is at the outer limits of harmonic intelligibility. At least it was for me and that's why I became obsessed with it. I had to understand it. What I'll never understand is how Shorter came up with these changes. I can't trace any of it back to anything familiar. I mean, it ain't "Girl from Ipanema," that's for sure.

And thank you for the kind remarks.

Dean

boehm #243862 03/13/14 09:11 AM
User Showcase
Joined: Dec 2012
Posts: 958
Expert
OP Offline
Expert
Joined: Dec 2012
Posts: 958
Guenter, my ever probing friend:

I'm not sure if "hiding behind the original" is right, but I'm not saying it's wrong either. I admit to having been obsessed with this tune and a subconscious motive for posting the original was possibly to show Forum members what they're up against if they're trying to understand a tune like this.

And, of course, I appreciate your positive response.

Dean

AudioTrack #243891 03/13/14 12:25 PM
User Showcase
Joined: Dec 2012
Posts: 958
Expert
OP Offline
Expert
Joined: Dec 2012
Posts: 958
Hi Trevor,

Thanks for your kind remarks. Of course, you're right about Shorter. His penetrating insight into harmony and instinct for the "hip zone" haven't been matched by anyone else I can think of.

Dean

User Showcase
Joined: Dec 2012
Posts: 958
Expert
OP Offline
Expert
Joined: Dec 2012
Posts: 958
Hi Janice and Bud,

Thank you for your kind remarks on Rio, a difficult tune if there ever was one. Glad to hear you're liking nylons (strings, not stockings). That inspires me to get that same sound into my next post.

Dean

cubanpete #243895 03/13/14 12:43 PM
User Showcase
Joined: Dec 2012
Posts: 958
Expert
OP Offline
Expert
Joined: Dec 2012
Posts: 958
Thanks Mike,

You're quite right. Give me old Carlos Montoya anytime, but there are some new and brilliant Flamenco players around that I've just discovered. For instance, check out Don Cortes Maya: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=359Bxg4Tp1w

What a sound he gets out of the instrument. The whole thing is just jaw-dropping. Some of those fire-breathing licks of pure Spanish soul can blast your clothes off. I hope you and others get to see that video.

Dean

tommyad #243897 03/13/14 12:51 PM
User Showcase
Joined: Dec 2012
Posts: 958
Expert
OP Offline
Expert
Joined: Dec 2012
Posts: 958
Tommy,

Special thanks for those generous and kind words. In fact, I do like to add a little extra to a post if I can. Whenever I find a link that I feel people have just got to see, I'll include it, even if it relates only tangentially to the music I'm posting.

Hearing that you find them a source of new knowledge and possibly inspiration is a real thrill.

I hear you got a rep now as the blues guitar king of the Forum. Buddy, you can add my vote to that.

Dean

dani48 #243898 03/13/14 12:58 PM
User Showcase
Joined: Dec 2012
Posts: 958
Expert
OP Offline
Expert
Joined: Dec 2012
Posts: 958
Thanks Dani and PGF,

I'm going to quote from my reply to MarioD about superfast guitar players:
Originally Posted By: aleck rand
With McLaughlin you can start at any point in any solo and hear a machine-gun burst of notes. At least that's what I hear. He does not seem to be a melodist as an improvisor. In other words, I can't imagine singing or even remembering any "licks" that might make me say, "yeah!" The only feature I can tell you about what I hear is that it's fast, not that it's, say, bluesy or Trane-like or has the same quality X that that other guitarist over there has, etc.

Paco, on the other hand, seems to deliver melodic ideas along with the speed. From my point of view, speed devoid of ideas is like a double-talk artist who can do it at high speed. So, er, whad 'e say?
Dean

Previous Thread
Next Thread
Go To
Page 1 of 2 1 2

Link Copied to Clipboard
ChatPG

Ask sales and support questions about Band-in-a-Box using natural language.

ChatPG's knowledge base includes the full Band-in-a-Box User Manual and sales information from the website.

PG Music News
Introducing XPro Styles PAK 10 – Now Available for Windows Band-in-a-Box 2025 and Higher!

We've just released XPro Styles PAK 10 for Windows & Mac Band-in-a-Box version 2025 (and higher) with 100 brand new RealStyles, plus 28 RealTracks and RealDrums!

Few things are certain in life: death, taxes, and a brand spankin’ new XPro Styles PAK! In this, the 10th edition of our XPro Styles PAK series, we’ve got 100 styles coming your way! We have the classic 25 styles each from the rock & pop, jazz, and country genres, and rounding out this volume's wildcard slot is 25 styles in the Praise & Worship genre! A wide spanning genre, you can find everything from rock, folk, country, and more underneath its umbrella. The included 28 RealTracks and RealDrums can be used with any Band-in-a-Box® 2026 (and higher) package.

Here’s just a small sampling of what you can look forward to in XPro Styles PAK 10: Soft indie folk worship songs, bumpin’ country boogies, gospel praise breaks, hard rockin’ pop, funky disco grooves, smooth Latin jazz pop, bossa nova fusion, western swing, alternative hip-hop, cool country funk, and much more!

Special offers until December 31st, 2025!

All the XPro Styles PAKs 1 - 10 are on sale for only $29 ea (Reg. $49 ea), or get them all in the XPro Styles PAK Bundle for only $149 (reg. $299)! Order now!

Learn more and listen to demos of XPro Styles PAKs.

Video: XPro Styles PAK 10 Overview & Styles Demos: Watch now!

XPro Styles PAKs require Band-in-a-Box® 2025 or higher and are compatible with ANY package, including the Pro, MegaPAK, UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, and Audiophile Edition.

Introducing Xtra Styles PAK 21 – Now Available for Windows Band-in-a-Box 2025 and Higher!

Xtra Styles PAK 21 for Windows & Mac Band-in-a-Box version 2025 (and higher) is here with 200 brand new RealStyles!

We're excited to bring you our latest Xtra Styles PAK installment—the all new Xtra Styles PAK 21 for Band-in-a-Box version 2025 (and higher)!

Rejoice, one and all, for Xtra Styles PAK 21 for Band-in-a-Box® is here! We’re serving up 200 brand spankin’ new styles to delight your musical taste buds! The first three courses are the classics you’ve come to know and love, including offerings from the rock & pop, jazz, and country genres, but, not to be outdone, this year’s fourth course is bro country! A wide ranging genre, you can find everything from hip-hop, uptempo outlaw country, hard hitting rock, funk, and even electronica, all with that familiar bro country flair. The dinner bell has been rung, pickup up Xtra Styles PAK 21 today!

In this PAK you’ll discover: Energetic folk rock, raucous train beats, fast country boogies, acid jazz grooves, laid-back funky jams, a bevy of breezy jazz waltzes, calm electro funk, indie synth pop, industrial synth metal, and more bro country than could possibly fit in the back of a pickup truck!

Special offers until December 31st, 2025!

All the Xtra Styles PAKs 1 - 21 are on special for only $29 each (reg $49), or get all 21 PAKs for $199 (reg $399)! Order now!

Learn more and listen to demos of the Xtra Styles PAK 21.

Video: Xtra Styles PAK 21 Overview & Styles Demos: Watch now!

Note: The Xtra Styles require the UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, or Audiophile Edition of Band-in-a-Box®. (Xtra Styles PAK 21 requires the 2025 or higher UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, or Audiophile Edition. They will not work with the Pro or MegaPAK version because they need the RealTracks from the UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, or Audiophile Edition.

Introducing XPro Styles PAK 10 – Now Available for Mac Band-in-a-Box 2025 and Higher!

We've just released XPro Styles PAK 10 for Mac & Windows Band-in-a-Box version 2025 (and higher) with 100 brand new RealStyles, plus 28 RealTracks and RealDrums!

Few things are certain in life: death, taxes, and a brand spankin’ new XPro Styles PAK! In this, the 10th edition of our XPro Styles PAK series, we’ve got 100 styles coming your way! We have the classic 25 styles each from the rock & pop, jazz, and country genres, and rounding out this volume's wildcard slot is 25 styles in the Praise & Worship genre! A wide spanning genre, you can find everything from rock, folk, country, and more underneath its umbrella. The included 28 RealTracks and RealDrums can be used with any Band-in-a-Box® 2026 (and higher) package.

Here’s just a small sampling of what you can look forward to in XPro Styles PAK 10: Soft indie folk worship songs, bumpin’ country boogies, gospel praise breaks, hard rockin’ pop, funky disco grooves, smooth Latin jazz pop, bossa nova fusion, western swing, alternative hip-hop, cool country funk, and much more!

Special offers until December 31st, 2025!

All the XPro Styles PAKs 1 - 10 are on sale for only $29 ea (Reg. $49 ea), or get them all in the XPro Styles PAK Bundle for only $149 (reg. $299)! Order now!

Learn more and listen to demos of XPro Styles PAKs.

Video: XPro Styles PAK 10 Overview & Styles Demos: Watch now!

XPro Styles PAKs require Band-in-a-Box® 2025 or higher and are compatible with ANY package, including the Pro, MegaPAK, UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, and Audiophile Edition.

Introducing Xtra Styles PAK 21 – Now Available for Mac Band-in-a-Box 2025 and Higher!

Xtra Styles PAK 21 for Mac & Windows Band-in-a-Box version 2025 (and higher) is here with 200 brand new RealStyles!

We're excited to bring you our latest Xtra Styles PAK installment—the all new Xtra Styles PAK 21 for Band-in-a-Box version 2025 (and higher)!

Rejoice, one and all, for Xtra Styles PAK 21 for Band-in-a-Box® is here! We’re serving up 200 brand spankin’ new styles to delight your musical taste buds! The first three courses are the classics you’ve come to know and love, including offerings from the rock & pop, jazz, and country genres, but, not to be outdone, this year’s fourth course is bro country! A wide ranging genre, you can find everything from hip-hop, uptempo outlaw country, hard hitting rock, funk, and even electronica, all with that familiar bro country flair. The dinner bell has been rung, pickup up Xtra Styles PAK 21 today!

In this PAK you’ll discover: Energetic folk rock, raucous train beats, fast country boogies, acid jazz grooves, laid-back funky jams, a bevy of breezy jazz waltzes, calm electro funk, indie synth pop, industrial synth metal, and more bro country than could possibly fit in the back of a pickup truck!

Special offers until December 31st, 2025!

All the Xtra Styles PAKs 1 - 21 are on special for only $29 each (reg $49), or get all 21 PAKs for $199 (reg $399)! Order now!

Learn more and listen to demos of the Xtra Styles PAK 21.

Video: Xtra Styles PAK 21 Overview & Styles Demos: Watch now!

Note: The Xtra Styles require the UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, or Audiophile Edition of Band-in-a-Box®. (Xtra Styles PAK 21 requires the 2025 or higher UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, or Audiophile Edition. They will not work with the Pro or MegaPAK version because they need the RealTracks from the UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, or Audiophile Edition.

Band-in-a-Box 2026 for Windows is Here!

Band-in-a-Box® 2026 for Windows is here and it is packed with major new features! There’s a new modern look, a GUI redesign to all areas of the program including toolbars, windows, workflow and more. There’s a Multi-view layout for organizing multiple windows. A standout addition is the powerful AI-Notes feature, which uses AI neural-net technology to transcribe polyphonic audio into MIDI—entire mixes or individual instruments—making it easy to study, view, and play parts from any song. And that’s just the beginning—there are over 60 new features in this exciting release.

Along with version 2026, we've released an incredible lineup of new content! There's 202 new RealTracks, brand-new RealStyles, MIDI SuperTracks, Instrumental Studies, “Songs with Vocals” Artist Performance Sets, Playable RealTracks Set 5, two new RealDrums Stems sets, XPro Styles PAK 10, Xtra Styles PAK 21, and much more!

Special Offers
Upgrade to Band-in-a-Box® 2026 for Windows and save up to 50% on most upgrade packages during our special offer—available until December 31, 2025. Visit our Band-in-a-Box® packages page to explore all available upgrade options.

2026 Free Bonus PAK & 49-PAK Add-ons
Our Free Bonus PAK and 49-PAK are loaded with amazing add-ons! The Free Bonus PAK is included with most Band-in-a-Box® 2026 for Windows packages, but you can unlock even more—including 20 unreleased RealTracks—by upgrading to the 2026 49-PAK for just $49. Browse the full contents of each package and listen to demos here.

XPro and Xtra Styles PAKs Special Extended Until August 31st!

XPro & Xtra Styles PAKs Special Extended Until August 31st!

The XPro Styles PAKs and Xtra Styles PAKs special offers are now available until August 31st at 11:59pm PDT!

Ready to take your Band-in-a-Box® 2025 experience to the next level? Now’s the perfect time! Expand your style library with XPro and Xtra Styles PAKs—packed with a wide variety of genres to inspire your next musical creation.

What are XPro Styles and Xtra Styles PAKs?

XPro Styles PAKs are styles that work with any version (Pro, MegaPAK, UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, or Audiophile Edition) of Band-in-a-Box® 2025 (or higher). XPro Styles PAKS 1-9 includes 900 styles!

Xtra Styles PAKs are styles that work with the UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, or Audiophile Edition of Band-in-a-Box® 2025 (or higher). With over 3,500 styles (and 35 MIDI styles) included in Xtra Styles PAKs 1-20, the possibilities are endless!

Get the XPro Styles PAKs 1 - 9 for only $29 ea (Reg. $49 ea), or get them all in the XPro Styles PAK Bundle for only $149 (reg. $299)! Listen to demos and order now! For Windows or for Mac.

Note: XPro Styles PAKs require Band-in-a-Box® 2025 or higher and are compatible with ANY package, including the Pro, MegaPAK, UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, and Audiophile Edition.

Get Xtra Styles PAKs 1 - 20 are on special for only $29 each (reg $49), or get all 19 PAKs for $199 (reg $399)! Listen to demos and order now! For Windows or for Mac.

Note: The Xtra Styles require the UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, or Audiophile Edition of Band-in-a-Box®. (Xtra Styles PAK 19 requires the 2025 or higher UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, or Audiophile Edition. They will not work with the Pro or MegaPAK version because they need the RealTracks from the UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, or Audiophile Edition.

Don’t miss this chance to supercharge your Band-in-a-Box setup—at a great price!

Mac 2025 Special Upgrade Offers Extended Until August 15th!

It's not too late to upgrade to Band-in-a-Box® 2025 for Mac® and save! We've extended our special until August 15, 2025!

We've added many major new features to Band-in-a-Box® 2025 for Mac®, including advanced AI tools like the amazing BB Stem Splitter and AI Lyrics Generator, as well as VST3 plugin support, and Equalize Temp. Plus, there’s a new one-stop MIDI Patches Picker with over 1,100 MIDI patches to choose from, all neatly categorized by GM numbers. The MultiPicker Library is enhanced with tabs for the SongPicker, MIDI Patch Picker, Chord Builder, AI Lyrics Generator, and Song Titles Browser, and the tabs are organized into logical groups. The Audiophile Edition is enhanced with FLAC files , which are 60% smaller than AIFF files while maintaining identical audio quality, and now ships on a fast 1TB SSD, and much more!

Check out all the new features in Band-in-a-Box® 2025 for Mac® here:

Purchase your Band-in-a-Box® 2025 for Mac during our special to save up to 50% off your upgrade purchase and receive a FREE BONUS PAK of amazing new Add-ons. These include the 2025 RealCombos Booster PAK, Look Ma! More MIDI 13: Country & Americana, Instrumental Studies Set 22: 2-Hand Piano Soloing - Rhythm Changes, MIDI SuperTracks Set 44: Jazz Piano, Artist Performance Set 17: Songs with Vocals 7, Playable RealTracks Set 4, RealDrums Stems Set 7: Jazz with Mike Clark, and more!

Upgrade to the 2025 49-PAK for just $49 and add 20 Bonus Unreleased RealTracks and 20 RealStyles, FLAC Files for the 20 Bonus Unreleased RealTracks, Look Ma! More MIDI 14: SynthMaster, MIDI SuperTracks Set 45: More SynthMaster, Artist Performance Set 18: Songs with Vocals 8, and RealDrums Stems Set 8: Pop, Funk & More with Jerry Roe.
Learn more about the Bonus PAKs!

Forum Statistics
Forums57
Topics85,172
Posts789,266
Members39,832
Most Online25,754
Jan 24th, 2025
Newest Members
Don Juan, Cyril Engram, Celia Pincus, Leila_Ask, Guarhone
39,832 Registered Users
Top Posters(30 Days)
jpettit 277
DrDan 201
MarioD 197
Noel96 147
DC Ron 137
Rob Helms 130
Today's Birthdays
David Fisher
Powered by UBB.threads™ PHP Forum Software 7.7.5