Previous Thread
Index
Next Thread
Print Thread
Go To
Band-in-a-Box for Windows
Joined: Feb 2015
Posts: 7,954
P
Veteran
OP Offline
Veteran
P
Joined: Feb 2015
Posts: 7,954
This was a response to Partial / bar to bar regen freeze concept
I have talked about this elsewhere but will reiterate.

Probably the reason it has not been implemented it that the tracks are currently generated into RAM as the complete track.
Maybe in the old days Biab had to do this ?
If I do the same in Reaper it is instant but is playing the track direct from disk, I can regenerate any section. Most DAW work like this. If you want Utility tracks to be the same as the BB tracks then they will have to fill up in RAM. If you generate a big song look at the RAM Biab is using, and if you want more than 255 bars how much RAM will that be ?

This is something I'm trying to get implemented with the BBPlugin so we don't have the wait times and a mountain of wav files filling up the hard drive.
The files Reaper is using are on an external USB drive playing direct from there and they are 48khz 24bit.

This can be implemented now with an option for old Pentium 100 users with XP to use the current way, but those with modern hardware will play direct from disk same as Biab plays back utility tracks direct from disk.
Once Biab calculates the sections of the source RealTrack files, instead of joining them together and writing to RAM Biab will play those sections of the wav/wma direct from disk and cut out the middle man.
This will then work as the pic below and easily regenerate any section.
As mentioned elsewhere when you freeze tracks Biab will save the RealTrack section data in the SGU then when you open that SGU the next day it will load and write them into RAM, BUT rather than do that it can play those sections direct from disk.
This will also allow frozen Biab SGU/MGU to be opened in the BB DAW Plugin with all the same sections and Utility tracks.


Band-in-a-Box for Windows
Joined: Apr 2016
Posts: 6,891
Veteran
Online Content
Veteran
Joined: Apr 2016
Posts: 6,891
Impressive mind & skills Pipeline.


Cheers
rayc
"What's so funny about peace, love & understanding?" - N.Lowe
Band-in-a-Box for Windows
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 12,195
Veteran
Offline
Veteran
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 12,195
I would love to support this idea, but honestly simply don't understand what is being proposed. crazy


BIAB – 2025, Reaper (current), i7-12700F Processor, 32GB DDR4-3200MHz RAM, 1TB WD Black NVMe SSD, 2TB WDC Blue SSD, 1TB WD Blue, 2 TB SK NVMe, 6 TB External, Motu Audio Express 6x6

Band-in-a-Box for Windows
Joined: Feb 2015
Posts: 7,954
P
Veteran
OP Offline
Veteran
P
Joined: Feb 2015
Posts: 7,954

Band-in-a-Box for Windows
Joined: Feb 2015
Posts: 7,954
P
Veteran
OP Offline
Veteran
P
Joined: Feb 2015
Posts: 7,954
So on the bottom is the RT source file with all the chords that were played, Biab chooses the sections it wants to play from the source file and plays them back in linear order on it's timeline direct from hard drive.
FULL SCREEN

Band-in-a-Box for Windows
Joined: Mar 2018
Posts: 6,731
Veteran
Offline
Veteran
Joined: Mar 2018
Posts: 6,731
Pipeline,
Awesome sketches and explanation!

"RealTrack section data in the SGU" - The "Position" data of RTs segments... sounds good, but
"can play those sections direct from disk"

Here is where I am a little bit concerned. External USB drives, especially spinners.
Because of various USB chip mfgs there might be a huge inconsistency with Random Access, because each minor change in arrangement will require a re-generation which is randomized in BIAB itself, therefore "seeking" those "different" sections and restructuring "what needs to be played" might take longer? I am just guessing here.

A gut feeling tells me, those who have BIAB on fast internal SSD drives or external SSDs with Thunderbolt 3 or higher, will actually see things speed up and process would be cleaner significantly.

I am very curious and a bit nervous how PG team will implement Utility Track functions. This was and still is my highest priority "wish" smile I see how mechanism you described will be the way to go for something of 10-15 tracks or even more in BIAB (legacy + Utility) and bar to bar regen.

P.S. Pipeline, are section transitions smooth when you do this in Reaper? Zero crossing and all that good stuff?

Band-in-a-Box for Windows
Joined: Feb 2015
Posts: 7,954
P
Veteran
OP Offline
Veteran
P
Joined: Feb 2015
Posts: 7,954
Originally Posted By: Pipeline
Another thing, using track data you should be able to highlight a section of chords, right click copy data, then paste data over the same chords in another section.
So if you have a riff you like playing in one spot you can copy it to another, all without wav rendering time same as I can in Reaper.

To give you an example how easy this works I put a RealTrak and RealDrum in a Reaper project, just remove the .mp4 from the download below.
RT 372 & NashvilleSwing Example wav.rpp.mp4

The project will look for
\bb\RealTracks\Guitar, Acoustic, Strumming Hank Sw 120\AcG011.wav
bb\Drums\NashvilleSwing8^\nashvilleswing8^_110_Style.wav
so point Reaper to those folder when prompted.
If you don't have wav just convert those two files from wma to a wav also.


Band-in-a-Box for Windows
Joined: Feb 2015
Posts: 7,954
P
Veteran
OP Offline
Veteran
P
Joined: Feb 2015
Posts: 7,954
This is playing a multitrack Drum along with other 48khz 24bit files from the USB 3 drive.
https://www.dropbox.com/s/szd9wcytf2vgv78/Reaper-24bit-48KHz.mp4?dl=0

This is an actual RealTrack playing direct from the Biab RealTracks folder:
https://www.dropbox.com/s/maxphbq184wg3sx/Reaper-RealTrack.mp4?dl=0

Here's 1/8 changes with a RealTrack playing direct from the bb\RealTracks folder.
https://www.dropbox.com/s/6lpq2hoes8eqe84/8th-Chord-Changes.mp4?dl=0

Band-in-a-Box for Windows
Joined: Mar 2018
Posts: 6,731
Veteran
Offline
Veteran
Joined: Mar 2018
Posts: 6,731
Pipeline,
transitions are pretty smooth smile
I wonder how hard it is to sand box this type of RT access into BIAB for beta testing?
There sure is a potential in this kind of approach.

Band-in-a-Box for Windows
Joined: Feb 2015
Posts: 7,954
P
Veteran
OP Offline
Veteran
P
Joined: Feb 2015
Posts: 7,954
This is the Reaper .rpp the frozen SUG would have the same section data like the info for item start/end position, playback rate pitch in the source file.
So when Biab generates it will choose those sections, so rather than write it to RAM it could just playback the items direct using it's elastique.dll as Reaper does.
RealBand will playback 48 tracks simultaneously from disk. it has destructive editing (same as Biab Audio Edit) whereas Reaper is non destructive so it's all done on the fly with elastique.dll.
So all the editing copy/paste, regenerate, saving is just the data with no wavs filling up the hard drive, it will be quicker, the most time would be spent rendering to RAM.
When Biab renders from RAM to wav is the same as rendering the sections together from hard drive, see Reaper pic below gluing the sections to a new file, but you only need to write to wav for final render otherwise it's all played back direct.


Quote:
<ITEM
POSITION 20
SNAPOFFS 0
LENGTH 2
LOOP 1
ALLTAKES 0
FADEIN 1 0.01 0 1 0 0
FADEOUT 1 0.01 0 1 0 0
MUTE 0 0
COLOR 19340004 R
SEL 0
IGUID {39C05E3C-D560-4D0A-B97E-1FF9B501DAA8}
IID 163
NAME D
VOLPAN 1 0 1 -1
SOFFS 28
PLAYRATE 1 1 0 -1 0 0.0025
CHANMODE 0
GUID {39C05E3C-D560-4D0A-B97E-1FF9B501DAA8}
<SOURCE WAVE
FILE "D:\bb\RealTracks\Guitar, Acoustic, Strumming Hank Sw 120\AcG011.wav"
>
>

Full Screen

Band-in-a-Box for Windows
Joined: Feb 2015
Posts: 7,954
P
Veteran
OP Offline
Veteran
P
Joined: Feb 2015
Posts: 7,954
Another point. if you are just working with the RT data
Quote:
<SOURCE WAVE
FILE "D:\bb\RealTracks\Guitar, Electric, Rhythm LoungeFunkChorus Ev16 080 Direct Input\e10301.wav"
>

and you would like to change it to Direct Input to add your own FX,
it can be easily done by change the source file path, or you could just copy a section that needs another FX and paste the data to another track and set it to \Direct Input\ keeping the same riff without loosing it due to regenerate:
Quote:
<SOURCE WAVE
FILE "D:\bb\RealTracks\Direct Input\Guitar, Electric, Rhythm LoungeFunkChorus Ev16 080 Direct Input\e10301.wav"
>

Previous Thread
Next Thread
Go To

Link Copied to Clipboard
ChatPG

Ask sales and support questions about Band-in-a-Box using natural language.

ChatPG's knowledge base includes the full Band-in-a-Box User Manual and sales information from the website.

PG Music News
Band-in-a-Box 2025 Italian Version is Here!

Cari amici
È stata aggerate la versione in Italiano del programma più amato dagli appassionati di musica, il nostro Band-in-a-Box.
Questo è il link alla nuova versione 2025.

Di seguito i link per scaricare il pacchetti di lingua italiana aggiornati per Band-in-a-Box e RealBand, anche per chi avesse già comprato la nuova versione in inglese.

Band-in-a-Box 2025 - Italiano
RealBand 2025 - Italiano

Band-in-a-Box 2025 French Version is Here!

Bonjour à tous,

Band-in-a-Box® 2025 pour Windows est disponible en Français.
Le téléchargement se fait à partir du site PG Music

Pour ceux qui auraient déjà acheté la version 2025 de Band-in-a-Box (et qui donc ont une version anglaise), il est possible de "franciser" cette version avec les patchs suivants:

BIAB 2025 - francisation
RealBand 2025 - francisation

Voilà, enjoy!

Band-in-a-Box 2025 German Version is Here!

Band-in-a-Box 2025 für Windows Deutsch ist verfügbar!

Die deutsche Version Band-in-a-Box® 2025 für Windows ist ab sofort verfügbar!

Alle die bereits die englische Version von Band-in-a-Box und RealBand 2024 installiert haben, finden hier die Installationsdateien für das Sprachenupdate:

https://nn.pgmusic.com/pgfiles/languagesupport/deutsch2025.exe
https://nn.pgmusic.com/pgfiles/languagesupport/deutsch2025RB.exe

Update Your Band-in-a-Box® 2025 to Build 1128 for Windows Today!

Already using Band-in-a-Box 2025 for Windows®? Download Build 1128 now from our Support Page to enjoy the latest enhancements and improvements from our team.

Stay up to date—get the latest update now!

Update to RealBand® 2025 Build 5 Windows Today!

Already using RealBand® 2025 for Windows®? Download Build 5 now from our Support Page to ensure you have the latest enhancements and improvements from our team.

Get the latest update today!

PowerTracks Pro Audio 2025 for Windows is Here!

PowerTracks Pro Audio 2025 is here! This new version introduces many features, including VST3 support, the ability to load or import a .FLAC file, a reset option for track height in the Tracks window, a taller Timeline on the Notation window toolbar, new freeze buttons in the Tracks window, three toolbar modes (two rows, single row, and none), the improved Select Patch dialog with text-based search and numeric patch display, a new button in the DirectX/VST window to copy an effects group, and more!

First-time packages start at only $49. Already a PowerTracks Pro Audio user? Upgrade for as little as $29!

www.pgmusic.com/powertracks.htm

Video: Summary of the New Band-in-a-Box® App for iOS®

Join Tobin as he takes you on a tour of the new Band-in-a-Box® app for iOS®! Designed for musicians, singer-songwriters, and educators, this powerful tool lets you create, play, and transfer songs effortlessly on your iPhone® or iPad®—anytime, anywhere.

Band-in-a-Box® for iOS® :Summary video.

Check out the forum post for more information.

Forum Statistics
Forums58
Topics84,145
Posts775,334
Members39,568
Most Online25,754
Jan 24th, 2025
Newest Members
Andill, AIDV, RickyLane, AudioQuestions, jl1
39,568 Registered Users
Top Posters(30 Days)
MarioD 188
DC Ron 100
rsdean 95
WaoBand 87
Noel96 75
dcuny 67
BYOBand 64
Today's Birthdays
Jan van der Linde
Powered by UBB.threads™ PHP Forum Software 7.7.5