When composing a song, I find it sometimes difficult or impossible to find a style that I really want. At times, this is a benefit because the composed song moves in an unplanned, surprising and good direction. Other times, I give up and claim defeat.
I think BiaB could benefit from AI by building custom styles in real-time that meet the user's needs. One of two types of user inputs could be used to accomplish this.
1. An audio file of a song whose style you want to replicate could be imported in MP3 or WAV format.
2. A pull-down menu containing hundreds of song titles would allow you to select a specific song.
[Note that option 1 would be a much more elegant and complete solution and wouldn't require humans to continually update a song title list.]
With AI assistance, once the desired audio file is imported or song title selected, the algorthm would analyze it and return all of the instruments and other musical qualities that define that song in the form of a style. The user could then use that custom-built style just like you use any of the currently available styles; add a chord progression to it, swap out instruments, etc.
In other words, rather than scrolling thru dozens and dozens of pre-built styles and forcing one of them into the song you are creating, it would build, from scratch and return the best style that matches the song you are interested in. Icing on the cake would be for the 5 or 10 best fitting styles to be returned for you to audition.
Taken to a logical conclusion, this could eliminate pre-built styles altogether. Everytime you want to create a song, the style would be built for you in real-time based on user inputs. Another benefit might be a reduction of the footprint size of the program since the rules to create a style would replace a database of styles.
The goal here is for no one ever to "claim defeat" because they couldn't find a style that matches what they hear in their head.
No doubt, this would be a large software effort but smaller than what Microsoft has invested to create Bing. And the skeleton of an AI module to accomplish this may very well be commercially available; if not I'm sure 20-something grad students would love to work on something like this, especially if their names are associated with the end product.
On a technical note, AI, and more specifically, artificial neural networks are very good at classification. I'm thinking that this is a classification problem. So the neural net would have to be trained on several songs in every genre and sub-genre for which coverage is desired. Blues, country, hard rock, light rock, reggae, the various flavors of jazz, etc. would need to be tackled one by one.
https://soundcloud.com/user-646279677 BiaB 2025 Windows For me there’s no better place in the band than to have one leg in the harmony world and the other in the percussive. Thank you Paul Tutmarc and Leo Fender.
A simple thing Biab could be made to do is Random Style creation that creates a unique style rather than an out of the box style that someone else is using for their song also or replicating:
I suggested finders in Biab like EZDrummer and EZBass using a midi source
I don't know anything about MIDI but upon a little research it appears that a team has almost accomplished what I expressed above. This company's approach seems to use AI to generate a non-editable piece of music. They use the term "Influences".
"Use temp tracks to control the composition process If you need to create an original score that has a similar emotional impact as another existing score, you can upload your own MIDI file to influence AIVA's composition process"
Perhaps someone can investigate this further and comment if this could be a stepping stone to advance BiaB.
https://soundcloud.com/user-646279677 BiaB 2025 Windows For me there’s no better place in the band than to have one leg in the harmony world and the other in the percussive. Thank you Paul Tutmarc and Leo Fender.
I post a lot of simple things PG can do to improve Biab/RealBand/BBPlugin and they seem to have a hard time with them. I remember they were going to implement Rewire but that turned out to be too complex let alone the complexities of implementing AI.
The random style creator is a simple thing and can give some great unique results rather than a out of the box style that others are using for their songs, there are good ideas and there are GOD ideas that can come through "random" actions, so you may get something better.
You have all the RT RD demo wma files maybe you could find a 3rd party AI app that can catalog them then choose the best RTs and RD to replicate as close as possible the source sample ?
The best thing about Biab by far is the content, the sooner you get that content out of Biab the more creative control and ease of use you will have, not tomorrow not the next day or year but right now.
There are apps that will split audio into separate instruments like Spleeter then you could match each instrument from RT RD solo wma demos to choose something close then add these to create a new style.
You just need to search and you might find an app that will do all this, maybe even a plugin to work in Biab ??
Here is an outline of just one of several approaches one could (in principle) use to produce a custom style in BiaB. The psuedo code is written in a non-AI or traditional form that would guide how I would tackle this problem. FWIW, for me, it's irrelevant whether AI or traditional means are used to deliver this functionality because it's all under the hood. My original thought would be to use AI simply because in my mind this appears to be a technically challenging computer code to write and an AI approach may be simpler to implement when all is said and done.
The main technical challenge I see in using a traditional computing approach would be in computing the Error (Line 30). This would seem to require a very deep understanding of music theory and perhaps music psychology at a fundamental level.
Does anyone know how the mathematical code could be written to determine the musical distance there is between the guitar styles of Stevie Ray Vaughn and David Gilmore, for example? Clearly there are differences we all can hear between these two artists. But how would one code in FORTRAN, C++, Java, or Phython to accomplish this?
I'd be interested to hear the opinion of any expert in this field as to whether the math and theory exists to do this traditionally.
Whether AI or traditional, in engineering we would call this a juicy problem dripping with opportunity.
https://soundcloud.com/user-646279677 BiaB 2025 Windows For me there’s no better place in the band than to have one leg in the harmony world and the other in the percussive. Thank you Paul Tutmarc and Leo Fender.
I don't think I'd be interested in a 3rd party software to do this for me. But if PG Music added this functionality to BiaB I'd probably use it for every song I work on.
That said, it looks like Jamahook and perhaps others have already blazed this trail which is good news.
https://soundcloud.com/user-646279677 BiaB 2025 Windows For me there’s no better place in the band than to have one leg in the harmony world and the other in the percussive. Thank you Paul Tutmarc and Leo Fender.
My limited experience is that the styles suggested, based on a song title/band/performer etc., are usually quite far from the actual style desired. I've given up on the Style Picker and start with one of a very few "styles" I know well enough as a starting point and, inevitably, replace almost everything from Realtracks to tempo. Bass is the most common problem, I've found, in matching "Styles" with a sound/song/artist. Sorry, no answers from me.
Cheers rayc "What's so funny about peace, love & understanding?" - N.Lowe
A limited search on this subject yielded some interesting results. First, I found a paper written by some folks in Spain.
"Methods based on probabilistic approaches such as Cope’s Experiments in Musical Intelligence (EMI) [18], [19] also focus on the creation of an automatic music composition framework. Both EMI framework and the proposed system are based on probabilistic models (for pattern selection) and the training data stored in the database comes from musical features extracted from MIDI files (rhythm, pitch, dynamics,…)."
The reference to Cope's Experiments in Musical Intelligence, got my attention, and this is what I found on it.
"While some of the music composed using this approach did prove fairly successful, most of its output was equally uninteresting and unsatisfying. Having an intermediary - myself - form abstract sets of rules for composition seemed artificial and unnecessarily premeditative. As well, having to code new sets of rules for each new style encountered proved daunting. I therefore revised the program to create new output from music stored in a database. My idea was that every work of music contains a set of instructions for creating different but highly related replications of itself. These instructions, interpreted correctly, can lead to interesting discoveries about musical structure as well as, hopefully, create new instances of stylistically-faithful music."
While both of these references don't deal directly with creating a desired style from a menu of tracks (RTs) it does show me that some quite capable people are working on pushing the limits of music generation. David Cope in particular seems well-credentialed in the areas of music composition and computer science. I'm convinced that at some point a team, somewhere, is going to produce, commercialize and market the wish expressed in this thread. I hope it's PG Music.
https://soundcloud.com/user-646279677 BiaB 2025 Windows For me there’s no better place in the band than to have one leg in the harmony world and the other in the percussive. Thank you Paul Tutmarc and Leo Fender.
XPro and Xtra Styles PAKs Special Extended Until August 31st!
XPro & Xtra Styles PAKs Special Extended Until August 31st!
The XPro Styles PAKs and Xtra Styles PAKs special offers are now available until August 31st at 11:59pm PDT!
Ready to take your Band-in-a-Box® 2025 experience to the next level? Now’s the perfect time! Expand your style library with XPro and Xtra Styles PAKs—packed with a wide variety of genres to inspire your next musical creation.
What are XPro Styles and Xtra Styles PAKs?
XPro Styles PAKs are styles that work with any version (Pro, MegaPAK, UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, or Audiophile Edition) of Band-in-a-Box® 2025 (or higher). XPro Styles PAKS 1-9 includes 900 styles!
Xtra Styles PAKs are styles that work with the UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, or Audiophile Edition of Band-in-a-Box® 2025 (or higher). With over 3,500 styles (and 35 MIDI styles) included in Xtra Styles PAKs 1-20, the possibilities are endless!
Get the XPro Styles PAKs 1 - 9 for only $29 ea (Reg. $49 ea), or get them all in the XPro Styles PAK Bundle for only $149 (reg. $299)! Listen to demos and order now! For Windows or for Mac.
Note: XPro Styles PAKs require Band-in-a-Box® 2025 or higher and are compatible with ANY package, including the Pro, MegaPAK, UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, and Audiophile Edition.
Get Xtra Styles PAKs 1 - 20 are on special for only $29 each (reg $49), or get all 19 PAKs for $199 (reg $399)! Listen to demos and order now! For Windows or for Mac.
Note: The Xtra Styles require the UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, or Audiophile Edition of Band-in-a-Box®. (Xtra Styles PAK 19 requires the 2025 or higher UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, or Audiophile Edition. They will not work with the Pro or MegaPAK version because they need the RealTracks from the UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, or Audiophile Edition.
Don’t miss this chance to supercharge your Band-in-a-Box setup—at a great price!
Mac 2025 Special Upgrade Offers Extended Until August 15th!
It's not too late to upgrade to Band-in-a-Box® 2025 for Mac® and save! We've extended our special until August 15, 2025!
We've added many major new features to Band-in-a-Box® 2025 for Mac®, including advanced AI tools like the amazing BB Stem Splitter and AI Lyrics Generator, as well as VST3 plugin support, and Equalize Temp. Plus, there’s a new one-stop MIDI Patches Picker with over 1,100 MIDI patches to choose from, all neatly categorized by GM numbers. The MultiPicker Library is enhanced with tabs for the SongPicker, MIDI Patch Picker, Chord Builder, AI Lyrics Generator, and Song Titles Browser, and the tabs are organized into logical groups. The Audiophile Edition is enhanced with FLAC files , which are 60% smaller than AIFF files while maintaining identical audio quality, and now ships on a fast 1TB SSD, and much more!
Check out all the new features in Band-in-a-Box® 2025 for Mac® here:
Purchase your Band-in-a-Box® 2025 for Mac during our special to save up to 50% off your upgrade purchase and receive a FREE BONUS PAK of amazing new Add-ons. These include the 2025 RealCombos Booster PAK, Look Ma! More MIDI 13: Country & Americana, Instrumental Studies Set 22: 2-Hand Piano Soloing - Rhythm Changes, MIDI SuperTracks Set 44: Jazz Piano, Artist Performance Set 17: Songs with Vocals 7, Playable RealTracks Set 4, RealDrums Stems Set 7: Jazz with Mike Clark, and more!
Upgrade to the 2025 49-PAK for just $49 and add 20 Bonus Unreleased RealTracks and 20 RealStyles, FLAC Files for the 20 Bonus Unreleased RealTracks, Look Ma! More MIDI 14: SynthMaster, MIDI SuperTracks Set 45: More SynthMaster, Artist Performance Set 18: Songs with Vocals 8, and RealDrums Stems Set 8: Pop, Funk & More with Jerry Roe.
Learn more about the Bonus PAKs!
We’ve expanded the Band-in-a-Box® RealTracks library with 202 incredible new RealTracks (in sets 449-467) across Jazz, Blues, Funk, World, Pop, Rock, Country, Americana, and Praise & Worship—featuring your most requested styles!
Jazz, Blues & World (Sets 449–455):
These RealTracks includes “Soul Jazz” with Neil Swainson (bass), Mike Clark (drums), Charles Treadway (organ), Miles Black (piano), and Brent Mason (guitar). Enjoy “Requested ’60s” jazz, classic acoustic blues with Colin Linden, and more of our popular 2-handed piano soloing. Plus, a RealTracks first—Tango with bandoneon, recorded in Argentina!
Rock & Pop (Sets 456–461):
This collection includes Disco, slap bass ‘70s/‘80s pop, modern and ‘80s metal with Andy Wood, and a unique “Songwriter Potpourri” featuring Chinese folk instruments, piano, banjo, and more. You’ll also find a muted electric guitar style (a RealTracks first!) and “Producer Layered Guitar” styles for slick "produced" sound.
Country, Americana & Praise (Sets 462–467):
We’ve added new RealTracks across bro country, Americana, praise & worship, vintage country, and songwriter piano. Highlights include Brent Mason (electric guitar), Eddie Bayers (drums), Doug Jernigan (pedal steel), John Jarvis (piano), Glen Duncan (banjo, mandolin & fiddle), Mike Harrison (electric bass) and more—offering everything from modern sounds to heartfelt Americana styles
And, if you are looking for more, the 2025 49-PAK (for $49) includes an additional 20 RealTracks with exciting new sounds and genre-spanning styles. Enjoy RealTracks firsts like Chinese instruments (guzheng & dizi), the bandoneon in an authentic Argentine tango trio, and the classic “tic-tac” baritone guitar for vintage country.
You’ll also get slick ’80s metal guitar from Andy Wood, modern metal with guitarist Nico Santora, bass player Nick Schendzielos, and drummer Aaron Stechauner, more praise & worship, indie-folk, modern/bro country with Brent Mason, and “Songwriter Americana” with Johnny Hiland.
Plus, enjoy user-requested styles like Soul Jazz RealDrums, fast Celtic Strathspey guitar, and Chill Hop piano & drums!
With your version 2025 for Mac Pro, MegaPAK, UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, Audiophile Edition or PlusPAK purchase, we'll include a Bonus PAK full of great new Add-ons FREE! Or upgrade to the 2025 49-PAK for only $49 to receive even more NEW Add-ons including 20 additional RealTracks!
These PAKs are loaded with additional add-ons to supercharge your Band-in-a-Box®!
This Free Bonus PAK includes:
The 2025 RealCombos Booster PAK:
-For Pro customers, this includes 33 new RealTracks and 65+ new RealStyles.
-For MegaPAK customers, this includes 29 new RealTracks and 45+ new RealStyles.
-For UltraPAK customers, this includes 20 new RealStyles.
Look Ma! More MIDI 13: Country & Americana
Instrumental Studies Set 22: 2-Hand Piano Soloing - Rhythm Changes
MIDI SuperTracks Set 44: Jazz Piano
Artist Performance Set 17: Songs with Vocals 7
Playable RealTracks Set 4
RealDrums Stems Set 7: Jazz with Mike Clark
SynthMaster Sounds and Styles (with audio demos)
128 GM MIDI Patch Audio Demos.
Looking for more great add-ons, then upgrade to the 2025 49-PAK for just $49 and you'll get:
20 Bonus Unreleased RealTracks and RealDrums with 20 RealStyles,
FLAC Files (lossless audio files) for the 20 Bonus Unreleased RealTracks and RealDrums
Look Ma! More MIDI 14: SynthMaster,
Instrumental Studies Set 23: More '80s Hard Rock Soloing,
MIDI SuperTracks Set 45: More SynthMaster
Artist Performance Set 18: Songs with Vocals 8
RealDrums Stems Set 8: Pop, Funk & More with Jerry Roe
New! Xtra Styles PAK 20 for Band-in-a-Box 2025 and Higher for Mac!
Xtra Styles PAK 20 for Mac & Windows Band-in-a-Box version 2025 (and higher) is here with 200 brand new RealStyles!
We're excited to bring you our latest and greatest in the all new Xtra Styles PAK 20 for Band-in-a-Box! This fresh installment is packed with 200 all-new styles spanning the rock & pop, jazz, and country genres you've come to expect, as well as the exciting inclusion of electronic styles!
In this PAK you’ll discover: Minimalist Modern Funk, New Wave Synth Pop, Hard Bop Latin Groove, Gospel Country Shuffle, Cinematic Synthwave, '60s Motown, Funky Lo-Fi Bossa, Heavy 1980s Metal, Soft Muted 12-8 Folk, J-Pop Jazz Fusion, and many more!
All the Xtra Styles PAKs 1 - 20 are on special for only $29 each (reg $49), or get all 209 PAKs for $199 (reg $399)! Order now!
Note: The Xtra Styles require the UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, or Audiophile Edition of Band-in-a-Box®. (Xtra Styles PAK 20 requires the 2025 or higher UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, or Audiophile Edition. They will not work with the Pro or MegaPAK version because they need the RealTracks from the UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, or Audiophile Edition.
New! XPro Styles PAK 9 for Band-in-a-Box 2025 and higher for Mac!
We've just released XPro Styles PAK 9 for Mac & Windows Band-in-a-Box version 2025 (and higher) with 100 brand new RealStyles, plus 29 RealTracks/RealDrums!
We've been hard at it to bring you the latest and greatest in this 9th installment of our popular XPro Styles PAK series! Included are 75 styles spanning the rock & pop, jazz, and country genres (25 styles each) that fans have come to expect, as well as 25 styles in this volume's wildcard genre: funk & R&B!
If you're itching to get a sneak peek at what's included in XPro Styles PAK 9, here is a small helping of what you can look forward to: Funky R&B Horns, Upbeat Celtic Rock, Jazz Fusion Salsa, Gentle Indie Folk, Cool '60s Soul, Funky '70s R&B, Smooth Jazz Hip Hop, Acoustic Rockabilly Swing, Funky Reggae Dub, Dreamy Retro Latin Jazz, Retro Soul-Rock Fusion, and much more!
Special Pricing! Until July 31, 2024, all the XPro Styles PAKs 1 - 9 are on sale for only $29 ea (Reg. $49 ea), or get them all in the XPro Styles PAK Bundle for only $149 (reg. $299)! Order now!
XPro Styles PAKs require Band-in-a-Box® 2025 or higher and are compatible with ANY package, including the Pro, MegaPAK, UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, and Audiophile Edition.
New! Xtra Styles PAK 20 for Band-in-a-Box 2025 and Higher for Windows!
Xtra Styles PAK 20 for Windows & Mac Band-in-a-Box version 2025 (and higher) is here with 200 brand new RealStyles!
We're excited to bring you our latest and greatest in the all new Xtra Styles PAK 20 for Band-in-a-Box! This fresh installment is packed with 200 all-new styles spanning the rock & pop, jazz, and country genres you've come to expect, as well as the exciting inclusion of electronic styles!
In this PAK you’ll discover: Minimalist Modern Funk, New Wave Synth Pop, Hard Bop Latin Groove, Gospel Country Shuffle, Cinematic Synthwave, '60s Motown, Funky Lo-Fi Bossa, Heavy 1980s Metal, Soft Muted 12-8 Folk, J-Pop Jazz Fusion, and many more!
All the Xtra Styles PAKs 1 - 20 are on special for only $29 each (reg $49), or get all 209 PAKs for $199 (reg $399)! Order now!
Note: The Xtra Styles require the UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, or Audiophile Edition of Band-in-a-Box®. (Xtra Styles PAK 20 requires the 2025 or higher UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, or Audiophile Edition. They will not work with the Pro or MegaPAK version because they need the RealTracks from the UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, or Audiophile Edition.
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