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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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Joined: Dec 2019
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Yes, I understand that your case is different. I use the external USB-3 Hd and the renders are very fast. I guess on an internal SSD it should be instantaneous.
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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Yes, I understand that your case is different. I use the external USB-3 Hd and the renders are very fast. I guess on an internal SSD it should be instantaneous. Close to it. And my guess PGM is doing this in part, so most people can have Audiophile on internal drive. Especially that should be easy with desktop systems, as customers can just add SSD that is shipped by PGM (not a spinner) to their system. Not sure if this will void warranty from PGM, but if I had a desktop, this is exactly what I would do. So here is another reason for you 
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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Joined: May 2018
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"Why stop using what works well"
Lets see here... My internal storage is maxed at 4tb (expencive) nvme. Previous installation 2+TB vs New Flac >1TB.
A good enough reason? Again, we know here that there are only special cases, your config, my config, his config..... Everyone is right, no problem. I also received a half-empty 4TB disk last year, and I plan to fill it with 2025 without investing in an overpriced NVME. The speeds noted in the BIAB context are not worth the investment, imho.
Biab Audiophile 2025 11.28 Win
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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"The speeds noted in the BIAB context are not worth the investment, imho."
That depends on your usage. If I can save a few hours a year on "speeds", considering generations, partial regenerations, auditions... That alone would worth switching to ssd -all flac version..for me.
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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Joined: Apr 2022
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Hi All,
If you have RT,s and RD,s folders with Wav,Wma and Flac files which one does BIAB play.
Cheers Barry
BIAB 2024 Audiophile Version Acer I7 16gb Ram 1Tb SSD.Cubase 13 Pro
Reaper 7.54 Numerous Waves Plugins.Spectral Layers
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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Hi All,
If you have RT,s and RD,s folders with Wav,Wma and Flac files which one does BIAB play. It's an excellent question and I don't think we know the actual answer at this stage. Previously when WAV and WMA both existed, WAV was used. But we are still endeavoring to find out where FLAC sits in the mix.
BIAB & RB2025 Win.(Audiophile), Sonar Platinum, Cakewalk by Bandlab, Izotope Prod.Bundle, Roland RD-1000, Synthogy Ivory, Kontakt, Focusrite 18i20, KetronSD2, NS40M Monitors, Pioneer Active Monitors, AKG K271 Studio H'phones
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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Biab Audiophile 2025 11.28 Win
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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Great. Is that from a PG Music announcement?
BIAB & RB2025 Win.(Audiophile), Sonar Platinum, Cakewalk by Bandlab, Izotope Prod.Bundle, Roland RD-1000, Synthogy Ivory, Kontakt, Focusrite 18i20, KetronSD2, NS40M Monitors, Pioneer Active Monitors, AKG K271 Studio H'phones
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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Ask them, they will tell you ;-)
Biab Audiophile 2025 11.28 Win
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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This surprises me. I would have thought 1 and 2 would be reversed.
BIAB 2025 Win Audiophile. Software: Studio One 7 Pro, Swam horns, Acoustica-7, Notion 6, Song Master Pro, Win 11 Home. Hardware: Intel i9, 32 Gb; Roland Integra-7, Presonus 192 & Faderport 8, Royer 121, Adam Sub8 & Neumann 120 monitors.
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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I think you are right Matt so let's say 1 WAV 2 FLAC 3 WMA. But if in the future we only have FLAC then ...????
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Biab Audiophile 2025 11.28 Win
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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Joined: Jan 2020
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MP.
i like your thinking.
add in track recording in flac like i can do in another music app and i would be a happy lad. ive done hundreds and hundreds of vocal tracks in flac.
noones complained yet.
merry xmas.
om
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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I think you are right Matt so let's say 1 WAV 2 FLAC 3 WMA. But if in the future we only have FLAC then ...???? Well, it would be fairly obvious that it would only use FLAC, surely? We really want to see a definitive statement from PGM on the selection order. PGM? Can you answer this?
BIAB & RB2025 Win.(Audiophile), Sonar Platinum, Cakewalk by Bandlab, Izotope Prod.Bundle, Roland RD-1000, Synthogy Ivory, Kontakt, Focusrite 18i20, KetronSD2, NS40M Monitors, Pioneer Active Monitors, AKG K271 Studio H'phones
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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If we only have Flac, then, no difference that matters?
As I understand it, WMA files must be read then decompressed then processed by BIAB. Flac files must be read then decoded then processed. WAV files are just read and processed. That explains why I think the priority you were given is not correct. Think of it this way: if all three file types exist for a particular RealTrack, and Flac is chosen first, then why not delete the larger WAV files when Flac files are installed, since the WAV files would never get read?
I have asked specifically about all this. Among other info, PG Music stated that the time to decode Flac files will be insignificant.
I would love to read a more complete explanation of this topic. I was trying to gather info so I could write something to append to the article I wrote in the Tips and Tricks Forum about the audiophile version. Right now, I’m just not sure what to write.
BIAB 2025 Win Audiophile. Software: Studio One 7 Pro, Swam horns, Acoustica-7, Notion 6, Song Master Pro, Win 11 Home. Hardware: Intel i9, 32 Gb; Roland Integra-7, Presonus 192 & Faderport 8, Royer 121, Adam Sub8 & Neumann 120 monitors.
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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As I understand it, WMA files must be read then decompressed then processed by BIAB. Flac files must be read then decoded then processed. WAV files are just read and processed. That explains why I think the priority you were given is not correct. As I understand FLAC, to create a FLAC file the source is compressed using psychoacoustic methods, then decompreseed and a difference correction track is produced from the differences, which correction will be applied when the FLAC is expanded. So on pure processing time from file to usable data, WAV would be quickest, then probably WMA, then FLAC. However that does not take into account the time taken to read the data from the media. With spinning-rust hard drives, that time is likely significant. I suspect with SSDs, rather less so, or possibly not at all.
Jazz relative beginner, starting at a much older age than was helpful.
AVL:MXE Linux; Windows 11
BIAB2025 Audiophile, a bunch of other software.
Kawai MP6, Ui24R, Focusrite Saffire Pro40 and Scarletts
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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Hi Gordon. I agree with most of that. My unscientific experience with Flac makes me suspect that decoding Flac is faster than uncompressing WMA.
However, PG music chose the highest compression setting for Flac to shrink the files, so decoding on our end takes the longest for the choices of Flac.
And you’re right: adding in the read time and considering the type of drive is important. I think I read that the audiophile drive from PG Music is an SSD. You could be correct especially if using a spinner drive; reading the smaller size WMA files on a spinner drive might indeed be faster than reading Flac files (larger than WMA, smaller than WAV).
It’s all a good question.
BIAB 2025 Win Audiophile. Software: Studio One 7 Pro, Swam horns, Acoustica-7, Notion 6, Song Master Pro, Win 11 Home. Hardware: Intel i9, 32 Gb; Roland Integra-7, Presonus 192 & Faderport 8, Royer 121, Adam Sub8 & Neumann 120 monitors.
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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Joined: May 2000
Posts: 15,778
PG Music Staff
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PG Music Staff
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Our tests have showed lightning fast decoding of FLAC files, regardless of method use to compress them, with no discernible differences in speed. That means it takes a long time to compress them, but it’s a short time to decompress them regardless. I don’t see any advantage in using low compression settings on FLAC files, assuming you can wait the extra seconds it takes for the one-time process to compress them. And the benefits is much smaller file sizes with identical lossless results.
Have Fun!
Peter Gannon
PG Music Inc.
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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Peter, thanks for chipping in.
A question being asked (above and elsewhere) is "if there are three file types on disk: FLAC, WAV & WMA, which one will BIAB choose to use?"
I am sure we know that WAV will take precedence over WMA, but where does FLAC sit in order of precedence?
BIAB & RB2025 Win.(Audiophile), Sonar Platinum, Cakewalk by Bandlab, Izotope Prod.Bundle, Roland RD-1000, Synthogy Ivory, Kontakt, Focusrite 18i20, KetronSD2, NS40M Monitors, Pioneer Active Monitors, AKG K271 Studio H'phones
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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Joined: May 2000
Posts: 15,778
PG Music Staff
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PG Music Staff
Joined: May 2000
Posts: 15,778 |
WAV files take precedence over FLAC if both are present.
Have Fun!
Peter Gannon
PG Music Inc.
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Band-in-a-Box for Windows
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I would love to read a more complete explanation of this topic. I was trying to gather info so I could write something to append to the article I wrote in the Tips and Tricks Forum about the audiophile version. Right now, I’m just not sure what to write. Matt, If you would, please provide a link to your article in the Tips and Tricks Forum about the audiophile version. I just ordered the 2024 upgrade to 2025 Audiophile Version of BiaB for the 1st time, after all these years. I'm (im)patiently awaiting the SSD ($600+) Thanks again for your generous advice, and help.
Bandcamp Soundcloud Win-11; BiaB-2025 Audiophile
Cakewalk; Melodyne-5; Scaler 2; NI Komplete:
Focusrite Scarlett 18i20
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